Aaron Hazouri is a Company Man: An interview about NECA, TMNT Toys, and Sesame Street - The Short Box Podcast Ep. 481

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In this episode of The Short Box. A lot of us who are artists were into Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles because it was so art driven back then. I even as a kid, I knew that this was different from like Batman or something. And the toys were so much weirder than anything else that was out. mean, if you looked at like He-Man or G.I. Joe, even Ghostbusters, that stuff was, it was fun, but it wasn't as weird as the turtle stuff. The turtle stuff was just so off the wall. was crazy. Every TMNT thing looked different.

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always get different artists to do this stuff. Board Game was different from the coloring books, which is different from the cereal, which is different. So it all looks so different. It was one of the only things,  the only properties that supported both the serious take and a crazy like Looney Tunes style take. can be serious like Last Ronin.  It can be crazy like Rise of the Turtles. It could just be like off the wall. It can be almost anything that you bring to it.

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intro music plays

01:21
Yep, Short Box Nation. Hello again, welcome back. And thanks for pressing play today. If you're brand new, welcome to the show. My name is Badr and this is the Short Box Podcast, the comic book talk show that brings you the best conversations about your favorite comics with the people that put their blood, sweat and tears into making them.  This is episode 481 and today we have   Aaron Hazouri joining us.  He's a man of many hats. All right, he's been a teacher. He's been and still is an illustrator. He's a cartoonist.

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And most recently, he is a toy designer and concept artist for NECA Toys, which is home to some of the finest collectibles  and action figures licensed from some of the most iconic films, video games, sports, music, and  television I'm talking about. They make toys and collectibles for  licenses like Nightmare Before Christmas. They've got the Universal Monsters license. They got music licenses for the likes of Rob Zombie and Iron Maiden. And they've got comic licenses. So they make toys and figures for DC Comics  and TMNT.

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And Aaron has designed some of those toys. He's created concept art and contributed  tons of packaging art  to NECA's various uh TMNT toy lines.  You can get him at the sign. Some of these things in person here in Jacksonville, Florida  on Saturday, December 20th. Aaron will be at Black Cat Comics doing a signing.  So bring your toys, bring your collectibles, bring your teenage meet and greet turtle figs, whether they're new in box  or...

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new out of box or idealist choice. Just make sure to get to Black Cat this Saturday from 11 a.m. to 2 p.m. to get Aaron to sign those things.  And yeah, we'll be talking to Aaron about the signing  as well as what he does at NECA,  some of the comic covers that he's done as well here in a sec. But first, you know I gotta go ahead and give a big shout out to the sponsors who make this show possible. I'm talking about Gotham City Limit Comic Shop and Collective Con, Northeast Florida's premier anime comic book.

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and pop culture event. Big shout outs to Gotham City Limit and Collective Con. And fun fact, today is, recording this episode Monday, December 15th, which is 13 years to the date that the Short Box put out their first episode, which I'm feeling like hella retrospective as well as emotional today. But I want to just say a big shout out to all the supporters, all the listeners out there who have ever pressed play on an episode of the Short Box, who have ever.

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uh, shared an episode who have ever liked a post or given one of the Instagrams a follow at whatever it may be. I appreciate all of you. Now, without further ado, let's welcome our guest of honor today. Short Box Nation. Let's give it up for   Aaron Hazouri.  What's up, Aaron? How you doing?  I'm doing great. Doing great. Congrats on 13 years. That's awesome. when you say it like that, uh, my beard suddenly just turned all gray.  Thank you, Aaron. I really appreciate that.

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Actually, you know what, Aaron, I failed to mention in that intro, you're from, you're from Jacksonville native. You're now living in Los Angeles, doing all these great things with NECA. Your career has blown up. But at one point you were one of the earliest guest interviews I had on the short box. Do you remember your episode?  That's true. Yeah, I was, you're in a little house, not a little house, you're in a house on Riverside, I think. I was. And it was, yeah, was you and gosh.

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Four other people are like it was an insane amount. Yeah, Aaron. actually went back to I went to go see if I could find that episode and there are so many things I know now about podcasting that I just wish I knew a fraction of back then. But I mean, you know, we're talking 2012, 2013 where podcasting was nowhere near this thing that is now in pop culture and within society. So, you know, whatever. But I ended up finding your episode. You're on episode 31, which we put out in October 12th.

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2013 and the description reads Adam Wallet gives Gam a challenge making this his third guest appearance. Also, Aaron Hazory, creator of Toast Guy Comics, also stops by to talk comicsology and his new webcomic. Also, Drew is back in town and the cast gets a surprise visit midway through the show. First of all, is way too much chaos already. That is so many things happening in one episode. What was I thinking? I do remember that day being very chaotic.

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But that's kind of like the perfect word to describe those early years of short box, which is chaos and energy and fandom. And you never know. Like you never knew who was going to stop by the show. It was pretty wild. I remember there being like, I don't know, four or five people in the room. And I remember Adam, Adam lettered. I was doing the toaster guy comics and Adam lettered those for me. It was very good. And feel like Ed, Ed Danceheart was there. I think so. Yeah. We still keep up with.

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And I don't remember who else was there. But I just remember there being a lot of people. It was kind of crazy. It was crazy. For sure. But I appreciate you just jumping on the show back then and jumping on the show now. think it's kind of interesting that we're both at these points in our career. Not to compare at all. think you were doing well above and beyond amazing things with NECA. But I guess when you think back, that was what, 2013? So yeah, about.

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you know, 12 years going on 13. I guess where were you at in your career at that time? was like, was this where you're at now? Was that always the goal or at some point between then and now? Was there something that happened to get you like on this track working at NECA concept art, packaging art? Like what do you recall from 2013? Well, let me think 2013. I think I had just quit my day job and

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was  trying to go full-time freelance as an artist, is  still tough. It was tough back then, especially from Jacksonville, Florida, because nobody knows  you in Jacksonville.  As all my college professors told me, was like, leave town. You gotta leave town. And I didn't listen  as early as I should have. So I ended up teaching,  like, I think a month after I was on the podcast, I was just like,  I was trying to find something that wasn't

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a corporate job. so somehow I still don't remember how this happened, but I ended up falling into teaching, having no zero experience doing it before I convinced him to hire me somehow like a full time legit art teacher, which in hindsight was insane on my part and the school's part. But whatever I got in. And I did that for a couple of years, but I really wanted to get into animation as like a story artist, a storyboard artist. And because I was in the comics, but there's no money.

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comics and there's not like, there's not a stable career in comics. It's all freelance. And if you can get the work, it's a ton of work and it doesn't pay well and it's exhausting. If I wanted something that paid a little better and it didn't involve as much like fitness, comics is a lot of, it's got to be tightly drawn, storyboarding is a lot looser. So that was my goal was to get into storyboarding. And so my wife and I, she was, I think she was laid off.

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2016, she was laid off. We're both like, let's do something else. So we sold the house, moved to LA and I just started hustling and it took a couple of years  and uh let's see. was getting somewhere, COVID hit and I kind of threw everything for a loop. And then after COVID, I was lucky enough to meet one of my idols as a kid, one of my cartooning like guys I used to copy his drawings out of the turtle comics.

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met him, met a couple other people and was teaching out here again as an art teacher. Again, stable income. And just kind of fell into doing uh NECA stuff, freelance at first. And then my  boss over here at NECA, who  hired me to do the freelance stuff was like, I think we want to bring you on full time.  Not because I'm that good necessarily, but because I'm here and  because...

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He can say, hey, do this, or we need this, or oh you knock this off really fast. So this wasn't the job I envisioned for myself. It's definitely the best job I could have gotten because since I moved out here, animation has kind of like completely contracted  and dried up. There's not nearly as much as it used to be.  And so that work is super, super hard to find. Jobs like this are really rare where you're just kind of doing whatever, whether it's

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concept art, whether it's design, whether it's illustration, whether it's research, just whatever it is. I think a lot of it is my boss needed somebody to get lunch with every day. Yeah, personality. Pretty easy going as far as I go. So that's really most of it is like I'm a lunch date. And then, you know, the work is, if it comes up, I do some work. Mostly it's to be a lunch date. Aaron, let me ask you this, because you said something in the beginning that

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It caught my ears, but also I feel like it is echoed a lot here in this city. And I imagine it might be applicable to anyone living in a smaller  metropolitan city, especially compared to like LA. But what we hear a lot here in Jacksonville is that, especially for the creatives, is that advice, hey, you need to move. You need to go to somewhere bigger where there is an art scene where artists can  make a living, that  just be like being able to pay the bills or actual stardom or whatever it may be. But we hear that a lot here. Hey, you need to move out of Jacksonville.

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Do you think  being in LA is still or your physical location is still important considering how much technology has come along where  people can send in work via email and  you got the FaceTime calls or the Zoom calls? guess how important is it to be at the center of these places like your LA's in New York? Is that still really important in today's day and age? Well, I think it depends. I think it's really easy to get your workout and it was not that hard back then to get your workout in front of people.

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That will get you like freelance work. If somebody sees your work on Instagram or whatever and says, this is cool, I'd to hire you. Which is partly how I started getting freelance work. But you have to be around the people that are going to hire you to form like a connection with them, like a personal kind of, know, rapport or whatever. That's a bigger deal as far as like getting hired somewhere. Now with like animation, since the studios are, there's fewer of them, their work is like really drying up.

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It's not as easy to get those jobs, but I still think if your goal is like a job job, you have to meet the people that are doing the hiring because they're not going to hire somebody they don't know for a staff position. If they're going to hire you for freelance, absolutely. If it's just based on your work online. But I think a lot of work is based on they say networking, but networking sounds like you're meeting people just to get work. And that's not really how it works. It's more like if you're around people that are hiring, then they're going to hire you because  they know you and they like you  almost.

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more so than your work. They want to know that you can get the work done and that you can get it done on time.  The quality of the work is expected to be like a certain level, but honestly, most of us were like in that middle third. We do pretty good work, but we do it on time and consistently. And the people that hire us know that because they've met. So I don't know if moving may not be as big a deal as it used to be, but I think Jacksonville, especially it's got a little bit of an art scene, but it's not like  most people that

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make it as an artist from Jacksonville, make it because they left Jacksonville and they met other people. I think you can still do the circuit of doing like comic book shows and meeting people that way. But even then you're like hustling to make money at those shows versus like meeting people, forming connections and stuff like that. So my job that I have now is through meeting two or three people. I had the work, but as an artist, again, I'm in like that middle third. I'm not that good, not bad, but I'm not like top tier.

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No one's gonna be like, Oh God, it's in our air in Missouri. No, it's just like I can I can do the work. OK, but the people that I've met think like, all right, this guy's,  you know, normal enough guy to have around the office.  He's not a weirdo.  He's funny to get lunch with. So let's hire him on to, you know, to do whatever. And then you get other work based on those people in that word about so  enough moving necessarily is what you got to do. But as far as Jacksonville goes, you got to at least get out of town and do some

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Comment book shows that are way out of town where you can meet other people that are in whatever industry it is you're trying to get into. I think like music is the same way you can put it out there on the internet really easily. But the people that are going to hire you for things or put you in touch with other people that can hire you for things, you got to meet those people. You don't really form a connection over the internet the same way you do just hanging out in the same room with somebody. Yeah,  I totally agree with that. I think that's a big reason why in the past couple of years, I've tried to put an emphasis on

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Attending things like New York Comic Con or even like Heroes con and you know to make it's one thing to send an email and read it and you know, like be introduced that way but there's nothing that beats like an in-person face-to-face like  there's so much nuance and Personality that's lost via email that you can't make up for it in person meeting and it sounds like  a big advantage What you're talking about is like being you know being top of mind for someone that's seen you every day

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I think it goes a long way and especially in like a creative endeavor. There's two or three people that were really important to me getting the job I have now. Brian Van Hooker, who does the turtles, a Ninja Turtles podcast, and he's talked to everybody, like everybody in the turtles world. um But he is friends with the guy who runs the turtles at NECA, which is Trevor Zamen, my boss. And Trevor's the guy who sculpted that uh turtle that's on your desk. He's like a really, he's a top tier sculptor. He's been in the industry for a long time.

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Um,  overseas, all the turtle stuff for neck and some other things, Sesame Street, and some other stuff.  And I think Brian might've shown him myself on Instagram.  And so after I met up with Brian,  um, Trevor offered me some freelance work doing a couple of, um, tune turtle figures because he figured I could do it fast and do it good enough.  And that cartoonist I mentioned whose work I used to copy as a kid, Ken, Ken Mitroni.  Um, I bought a piece from him.

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We were Facebook friends. And he messaged me and said, Hey, do you want to meet up and pick this up? I said, yeah, this was like right after COVID.  So we met in a parking lot  over by my house because he was in town and we hung out for like two or three hours. And I think he had been bugging my boss to hire me as well.  Ken's really good about getting everybody. So those two guys and Trevor, uh they bugged Trevor enough to, I think, convince him to give me the work. And then I met up with him a few times and I think he figured I was.

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I was both  not a weirdo and I was in town. I was close by. So those two things together, plus being able to do the work like quickly. That's a deadly trifecta right there. Likeable, likable and normal. Yeah. In person, you know, what do they call it in the meat space, your your 3d  and pretty damn good at drunk. Well, yeah, and also able to take critiques that are not like, you don't get a whole lot of like tiptoeing around,  at least not with like people I

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Trevor's not gonna be like, well, let's talk about this. It's more like, no, this sucks. Or this isn't what I asked for. You can't like, oh, what do mean? You have to just beg. Okay,  what do you want? I don't know. Try it again. And you you can't like be precious about it. I've spent weeks on things that are just like, no, we're not gonna use this. And you, you definitely can't like,  like freak out over you have to just like, okay, that's fine. Whatever. So like your personality is  as important or more so than the actual work you're doing, I think when it comes to getting jobs.

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being hired for stuff. You can be an incredible artist. I could say their names. I can name a couple of artists that are really, really good, but because of their personalities, they just you're not getting work anymore because it's difficult to work with. And I was going to ask for you, like what was the learning curve or how is that transition into, you know, working in this role for NECA for like a company for a brand as big as NECA where, you know, you're coming from.

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You we talked a little bit about, your first appearance on the short box was to talk about, you know, your creator on comic, know, toast, uh, toaster guy. And you were coming from a illustration and,  know, uh, indie comic background where. You know,  you were trying to build, you know, your own brand, your own look and feel and get your name out there. Now you're working this job where for the most part, like,  unless you're like in the know, it's, kind of like, there's a lot of anonymity.  I can never say that word, right.

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Thank you so much. You're kind of anonymous to the general public because you are trying to uh tap into a certain look and feel for the turtles. I think a lot of your work taps into the  classic  80s  cartoon show and that look and feel. guess, was there any difficulty for you to overcome that or just accept, OK, well, instead of being Aaron Hazory, creator of  XYZ, I'm now part of this machine at NECA?

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Well, not  for me. The biggest difference is when you're a freelancer, probably 75 % of your time is spent looking for work, like trying to find work. And then maybe another 10 % is trying to get paid for the work. So like 15 % of your time is actually doing the work. The rest of your time is just, I'm trying to find it. I'm trying to get paid or like just uh stress over not knowing where the next job is coming from. That is like,  that's, that's horrible.

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So having a regular job like this is really cool. Cause I'll spend weeks on something. Like I said before, and they're not going to use it. Yeah. I still get paid for it. there may be stuff that I just don't want to work on, but they're like, well, you got to do it. And you go, okay, this wasn't my dream to draw. Uh, what did I have to work on? I don't want to disparage anything, but I had to do an alpha thing a couple of years ago. I never had any dreams to work on. But, you know, my boss is like, Hey, you're gonna do this.

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Okay, can do Alf or there was a couple other things and you know, even if you're hard to sign in it,  you got to do it anyway. Or even if you have a certain like, this is another big difference from freelance. If you have a vision for something and the people who make the decisions are like, no, our vision is different. can't  fight fears a little bit, but there's a point where you got to be like, all right, that's fine. I'll do it the way you want it to be done, but you're still getting paid for it. So for me, the transition was not that difficult. There's

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There's things that I have to do now that I never did before. I never did any digital painting really. And I always just hired colorists for stuff. So once I came on here, I'm not gonna hire anybody. I'm the guy they hired. So I had to learn how to paint pretty fast. And I painted a couple of turtle things. My boss was like, yeah, those are good enough. They're not like, they're not gonna be hanging in the, know, by the Mona Lisa or anything, but they'll sell some toys. So it's fine. Not being able to like pick and choose projects, that was a little bit of a

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transition for me and having to learn how to paint digitally, which I'm still learning. um That was a transition. But other than that, it's,  it's,  it's really great. Not having to look for work, not having to take on a job that you don't really want. I mean, I was teaching, which I love doing, but kids can be horrible. And you don't have a choice when you're teaching, you have to deal with horrible children.  And um this is like, there's no kids unless,  you know, Travis, our designer, he brings his kids in sometimes, but his kids are super cute. So it's never an issue.

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That's awesome. Aaron, I'm like stupid happy for you, man. I'm telling you, uh it's just been a very reflective day for me. So, you know, preparing for this interview, doing the research and just remembering some of the conversations that we've had in the past. feels like everyone that is from Jacksonville that has made it into comics is doing great things. You, Al Letson, uh Adam Bryce Thomas, you know, he's doing like Sonic comics with the Justice League and things.  What can I say? Jacksonville. We breed some awesome comic book superstars.

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What was your first NECA project that was actually like put out into the public and made public for everyone? And then I also want to know what is the best maybe selling NECA thing that you've worked on? So what was your first and what was the best selling? Let me think. The first, I think there were two or three things I did. think someone had done the neutrinos before me and they didn't look too good. So I did the neutrinos, but I also did I think Donatello the dark turtle.

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kind of like the Batman, Donatello and think Scrag, one of the gangsters. Those I think I did around the same time. And then ah the best selling one, have no idea. Cause they're all like, I might do one that's like an exclusive for Comic-Con that blows up or I might do one that is for Target and they order a certain number of units. And then we don't really know what happens after that. We just know they've ordered this many. So. um

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I don't know. mean, I think that those pizza club turtles that I did  last year, those were the four turtles in those Burger King Kids Club style boxes.  And those were a pretty big deal for me because I hadn't painted the turtles before. So that was like my trial by fire to see if I could do it. And that turned out OK. But those I think sold pretty well for me, the ones that I got the biggest. Now, I don't want to say biggest, but I like doing the Sesame Street ones because that was.

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So different from anything else I had done. I'd done so many turtles. To do Sesame Street was really cool. To get to work on those was  like a completely different thing. So I don't know what the best selling one is. I have no idea. You know, I'm glad you brought up the  Sesame Street project you're able to work on. For those unaware, Aaron did the uh box art, packaging art for a pair of Ernie and Bert figures. If you go on Aaron's Instagram, which I do have linked in this show notes, uh your profile picture is with you and Ernie.

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I mean, the profile pictures don't get much better than this. You were actually able to go to Jim Henson's workshop and to the whole Sesame Street workshop. Can you talk a little bit about like what you got to see there? Yeah, sure. My boss, again, he's had a long career and he worked  at the company. He was like an intern or something at the company called Puppet. He builds the puppets for the Muppets out. So I'm just don't build all that stuff themselves. There's a company that does it for them.  The Henson company sort of um maintains them and

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handles some restoration of some older stuff, which is what they were working on while they were there. But because my boss had worked there, he made some connections with some people. And one of those people that he was friends with back then works at Sesame Street. So when we were in New York for Toy Fair on my birthday, we got to go to the the Muppet Workshop in New York, which is like right across from the studio where they filmed Sesame Street. And we didn't get to take pictures of most of what was up there, but it's full of just

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vintage Muppet stuff. there's like, just a whole cabinet full of or like a shelf full of boxes that just have Muppets in them. My bosses from Laura was pulling stuff out. they were like, there's Rover in this one, Cookie Monster or Bert. And at the end of the tour, they're like,  we let everybody who's here get their picture taken with a Muppet.  they they my boss got to pick because he's the one that took the thing out for us. And that was the Ernie that was Ernie from the show. It's not like some prop.

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that's that's like Ernie. They put Ernie on and got underneath.  Yeah, was really, really cool. mean, we got to touch Burt's eyebrow, which is crazy.  And we got to touch Grover's arms. I mean, was just it was really, cool. My boss was able to set that up. He didn't say anything until we got there. We're in like the sketchy neighborhood in New York and Queens. Like,  what are we doing? But I figured out once we got inside, was going on was really cool.

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Aaron, I've heard a lot of accomplishments and just things in general from uh some of my guests that have made me  green with envy. But hearing you say you were able to touch uh Bert's eyebrow is peak envy over here. I'm kind of jealous of that.  mean, I've done some cool stuff. Thanks mostly to this job, but that was like, that was one of the top two experiences I've had. um And  I'll tell you about the other one. This is like a turtle thing. Turtle fans.

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Old school turtle fans will understand how big a deal this was, but there was an event last year for the 40th anniversary of the turtles. And it was a small convention, like a, it was the 40th anniversary of a small convention where they had debuted the turtles 40 years ago. And it was in Portsmouth, New Hampshire. And it was all the original turtle guys, except for like one. But it was everybody, Kevin Eastman,  Jim Lawson, Eric Talbot, all those guys, Steve Levine, they were all there. And I got an invite just,

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by pure luck. think Brian again was able to get me in.  But they set me up between my childhood hero, Ken Metroni and the other Turtles cartoon artist, Chris Allen. I was like right between those two guys. And so I got to sit with those guys, hang out with them. And Steve Levine, who's the nicest dude, he did all the old Turtles like licensing art. If you had a Turtles t-shirt in the  nineties or eighties, it was a Steve Levine drawing on it. So he was, he comes over to my table and he's like, Hey,

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just a heads up if you want to meet and Peter Layers going to be here in like in a few minutes. So just come on by. I'll introduce you. said, Oh my God, no way. So I went over there and got to meet Peter Laird crowd and it was, it was the coolest thing. It's like  the turtle people have been for the most part, just so super nice and welcoming and getting to meet those guys whose stuff I grew up with was like, that's like that in Sesame Street. are the two top tier.

27:14
And I mean, is it safe to say, uh because I was uh browsing your Instagram and you've got a couple of posts where you're like, hey, Kevin Eastman signed, you know, this sketch of mine or his and vice versa. It sounds like you've had a chance to meet or at least interact with Kevin Eastman and Peter Laird a few times, right? Peter I've only met once because Peter doesn't get out much. But Kevin, Kevin, I've met a few times and there was a story.  I shouldn't tell this.  I'll tell a little bit.

27:42
There was this comic I had done that I wasn't super happy with, but I had been involved with it and the person publishing it,  I shouldn't tell this story, but I'm going to,  gave me a copy of it at uh San Diego. I  was at the NECA booth, Kevin was coming for a signing. So I'm holding this comic and I see Kevin coming and my boss is there with this grin on his face.  And if you know my boss, if people have seen Trevor,  he's got this long hair, he looks a little bit like Rasputin, but he has this grin on his face.

28:12
And I said, this is not good. So I took this comic and I knew that Kevin Eastman was going to see this if my boss had his way. I went through the comic in the trash, came back to the booth and my boss had vanished and Kevin's on his way. And I see my boss over at the trash. said, you guys, these big trash, my boss is trying to find this thing. I had to run over and make sure he couldn't find it and show it to Kevin. so a couple of minutes later, I go to Kevin. said, you ever?

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Did you ever been involved with anything that you just regretted and were completely embarrassed by after?  He goes, oh yeah.  Oh yeah, absolutely. I feel right now.  But he didn't see it. So I saved myself the embarrassment just because that would have been the worst if he had seen this thing. It was just so, oh God. Aaron, you know what I like about you and I feel like this is a consistent thing throughout the years is that  I think you're very modest.

29:09
And you're also very, your bar for uh excellence is very high.  can tell it has to be, you have to be like, because there, there are some, especially working for NECA, there are some licenses like turtles  or Sesame street where the people that work for whether it's Nickelodeon or Sesame street, they have a certain bar also, and they want the work to be at a certain level, but they may also want it to look a certain way that

29:38
you don't necessarily agree with. So you have to, um like at NECA, we do a lot of things that are vintage based, based on things from the  80s or 90s or whatever. And some of these characters are still like Sesame Street is super in the public eye nowadays. It's as big as it ever was, but the characters have a different look now than they did way back then. some of what you, what I have to do, has to marry the modern look with the old look. So you can't be like,

30:08
precious about the work you do. can't be like, oh, it's got to look, I want it to look this way.  You're just like, all right,  it's fine.  I definitely want it to have the standard that can  make me happy and also make Sesame Street or whoever it is happy. But also whatever I'm attached to  that isn't going to work for the project, I have to just be like, all right, it's fine, whatever. None of this is precious.  You can have an ego if you're big.

30:35
someone like me in this vast middle ground of  artists, you have to just be like, whatever it is to get done, I'll get it done. People like it. That's fine. They don't like it.  Also,  I do box art.  Most of the boxes you've thrown away anyway.  I was in some  Facebook group once someone had proudly posted a picture of themselves burning all of their neck of boxes. Save the picture. And I sent my boss, he's like, Oh, that's great. Because that's that's where they go. So now we have a pile of my boxes that I've drawn.

31:05
And my boss will be like, oh yeah, that's just thrown in the trash pile. Cause really all of this is just the stuff in the box, the toys are what people want, the stuff on the box and just kind of like whatever. It's fine. Aaron, then I am among maybe whatever the 1 % that keep their box. I still keep all my box. If I do happen to take a figure out of a box, I'll put the box in my storage unit, which is I do not recommend anyone do. That is how you rack up storage unit fees for the rest of your life. Don't do this. All right. I'm crazy.

31:34
I guess I've been podcasting for 13 years like a psychopath. But I say all that to Aaron, to say that I think we are living in one of the best, and I don't know if this is a hot take. I think this might be a little hyperbole, but I think we're living in one of the best times for toys, collectibles, adult action figures, whatever you may call it. I feel like from things like, you know, everything NECA is doing to, you know, Super 7 is out here killing and McFarlane toys seem to only get better and better.

32:01
I sometimes look at my little nephews who don't give a shit about toys and I'm like, you guys are missing out. Like this, I wish I had this quality of toys and box art and packaging.  have like people that are our age, they grew up with this stuff, but saw that some of the toys were just not that great. And we saw like cartoons, like whether it was turtles or like  Mondo is doing these real Ghostbusters toys that I have on my desk over here. They're really cool. All of us who were kids back then wanted toys that looked like the show and

32:30
NECO, think NECO was the first, thanks to my boss, Trevor, was the first company to really be like, let's take this cartoon and do everything with Turtles. Everything that was in the show that we all wanted and never got. Let's make it look like the show. that's, that's  every company now, whether it's Mondo or Super 7 or McFarland, but especially NECA will  spend the time doing the research. They'll spend the time getting the sculpts right. They'll spend the time getting the paint.

32:59
And he ever used to detail this stuff, right? And occasionally are, you know, the higher ups will say, this is going to be too expensive to make right now. We're going to hold off on this. But most of the time we can figure out a way to make a toy that looks just like the thing that we're referencing. And you didn't have this in years past. I think you're probably right. Within the past 10, 15 years, toys have gotten so good that it's like the fidelity to the source material is just incredible. it's

33:25
especially with some of the Sesame Street stuff we're doing and some of the stuff that hasn't come out yet. I've seen things, we've done so much research and there's so many different looks for some of these characters. And it's like, how can we  make this look as good as we can,  even though the character looked a dozen different ways?  I know for the count, for example, I worked on the Count Boxheart, but also my boss was like, we got to figure out the Count's cape. And the inside of the Count's cape has had two or three different looks. And we're going after the old school 70s look.

33:54
which is hard to find reference for. So my boss is like,  you just got to make a pattern for it. Cause we don't know what it looked like, but we know we don't want this  90s pattern. So I spent like a day or two just, just making patterns for the counts Cape that looked enough like the old pattern that, you know, we could use that instead of having to use whatever the modern one is. And I don't know a lot of companies that would let you just sit for two days and  come up with a pattern for the inside of the counts  Cape lining. It's something that.

34:23
that NECA and a couple of the other companies will really spend time and money and research and make this stuff look good. Yeah, I'm glad you said that because I was thinking about what separates NECA from any of the other companies that I've talked about where I think all of them, a rising tide raises all ships. think you mentioned Mondo, great example of the quality of toys, the attention to detail, the packaging being pristine and great art and things like that. And I think

34:52
uh The example you just shared kind of speaks to think NECA's attention to getting it right.  know, I look at  something like the Bodacious Beach Bros  TMNT 4-pack, which you did some of the box art for. um And you know, it's like, man, this looks like it was ripped straight from the cartoon or even like some of the video game figures that you guys have. Do do concept art for the actual molds and sculpt too? Because it sounds like you wear a couple of different hats at NECA. It's not just drawing box art, but also being involved with the sculpt and the way it'll look there.

35:23
with concept art here, kind of a, it's not like it might be if you're doing a toy line from scratch. So there've been a couple of characters that I've gotten to kind of design, like Panda Khan, for example, I got to kind of design that from the ground up. Real quick, I love that figure. What is it? Crouching Panda? No, it crouching Panda hidden turtles? Is that what the phrase on the box is great? We had a list.

35:50
And I don't know how  I managed to find out that was yours, but I remember picking up that figure at like Gotham City Limit. They seemed to always have a lot of the neck of toys there. And once I realized that that was your art, I started playing the game of like, can I figure out? And I mean, it's kind of tough because like I said, you know, it's not like you sign your signature on the stuff that you draw, which I think is interesting if you're coming from a comic book illustrator background.  thank you. That was one where I did actual

36:18
concept sheets. And there's a couple that I've done like actual concept drawings, but most of the concept art that we do  is to show like Nickelodeon or Sesame Street, just to show them, Hey, this is what we want to make.  Cause they don't always get it unless they see it like spelled out for them. we'll go like, here's the character. Here's uh the accessories we want to include with them. And when I first started this, would spend a lot of time, but I quickly figured out and my boss is like, you don't have to spend that long on this. So now it's like, you knock this stuff out fast, but

36:48
You need to be able to knock it out fast and have it so look good versus just kind of  crudely drawing something that might confuse a license or like you don't want Sesame Street to say, is this terrible looking drawing of Big Bird or whatever it is?  you  want someone that can draw it good enough and draw it fast and slap some color on it. So that's mostly like the concept. Concepts not  you don't spend that much time on them because they're not that big a deal. The sculptor is going to do what they do.

37:18
based on my boss, Trevor is the art director for Sesame Street for Turtles and some other stuff we're he's everything filters through him. So the sculptor will get a ton of reference from Trevor, whether it's from the cartoon or from the movie or whatever it is we're doing Sesame Street screenshots. And he'll send that to the sculptor and they'll work with him directly. They don't usually look at a concept sheet unless it's something like a Pandacon. And then I might have to do like.

37:45
turnarounds or like side views so the sculptor has some idea what this thing looks like from every angle. I've had to do that a couple of times on things or if a sculptor is just having trouble figuring out what does this thing look like from the side. Sesame Street, you don't always see the whole thing so you might have to figure out what is this like from the waist down. um How  fat is this guy? How skinny is he? What does the back of the cape look like? Whatever. So I'll do some of those drawings um just like randomly, know, hey, can you do

38:14
the counts cape. He's got this collar that comes up. What does it look like from the side? um And again, I think my boss knows enough to know he doesn't have to tell me go look here, find these pictures, and then he'll just say, hey, we need this. So that means all right, I got to find reference for it. I got to do some research. I got to pull from this. Maybe there's photos somewhere. um So the concept stuff I do is a lot of that kind of stuff, just like random little drawings. I do a lot of packaging concepts. I might do um

38:42
40 drawings of something. My boss will look at them all and be like, no, these all suck. And then I'll do 40. We have to be able to do a lot of concepts. And again, not like take it personally when your boss is like, don't like these. Or he may like something. And then two weeks later, be like, I don't like this as much as I did two weeks ago. Or I like this better than I two weeks. Like that happens sometimes, you know, and you can't like take it personally. Just like, all right, that's fine. I'll redo it. got to ask you, when you were first starting out,

39:12
at Neck Up. How often would you go into the stores to do on-site, on-field research or to see, this is what it looks like among the other toys, and it's whatever, at a target. This is how it will be displayed. Did you ever have any moments where you were so excited about landing this job that you, I don't know. I think about new comic book creators and what it must be like to have, whatever, get your first gig at Marvel.

39:41
and how excited you could be going to a shop on new comic book day to see your book there. Is that feeling, I guess, uh relevant, I guess, in your role when you first started out with Mecca?  I mean, a couple of times when I would walk into Target and see some of my stuff on the shelf. That was kind of cool a couple of times. But there's enough times where on the internet they're like, oh, look at these shelf warmers. It's my artwork. like, yeah, OK.

40:11
Or people will complain about like, more turtle variants because we're doing the bodacious beach turtles or whatever. It's  that kind of  you quickly decide, all right, I don't need to go look for this stuff or read comments anymore. It's cool enough to get the gigs. But honestly, for me, getting to know the professionals whose work I looked at as a kid and used to copy, that's been the coolest part for me. Ken  and Steve and all the turtle guys. To be able to talk to those guys, I you get phone calls from Ken Metroni,  for me is like,

40:40
It would be like getting a phone call from, I don't know, Chuck Jones or Bob Plampton or somebody. It's, it's, or Jack Kirby or someone. Cause he was the  artist whose work I used to copy as a kid, like drawing out of the comic books to talk to those guys. Now as like a fellow professional is, is really cool. That for me is cooler than seeing myself in the boxes to, be legit enough to be able to talk to those guys. Like we're somehow equals, even though we're not, but to be able to talk to them like we are, that's been the best part of this whole thing.

41:10
It's really cool. What's the best piece of advice that you've gotten from any of these peers or colleagues or people you admire? Like, you gotten any whatever one piece of advice that's really kind of changed your perspective, whether it be on the profession  of illustrating or toys or even just like TMNT in general? Like, I'm curious, like, have you had any conversations or gotten any advice from these guys? The best advice I've gotten is to not fuss over things too much, to kind of just do it.

41:40
get it done and move on to the next thing. I do tend to like overdo things  a little bit and the best advice I've gotten is just do it and move on to the next one because there's enough work you don't want it to pile up, you know, get behind on things. That's like that's that's one of best advice I've gotten is just to do it. And the other thing I keep hearing from Chen and Steve, these other guys, they're like, you're not a fan now. Relax. You  got the job. You're professional. You're not a fan.

42:09
Because I still turn into a fan boy when I'm around these other turtle artists. It's like  when I was between Ken and Chris at that show the whole time, I'm like, oh my God. I'm across from Gary Fields, who worked for Cracked Magazine and used to letter the turtle comic. So I'm around these guys like, I'm,  know,  Brian and I at that Portsmouth show, we're both at this dinner. Kevin Eastman was there. And Kevin came over to our table to say hi.  you know, Brian and I are both like, oh my God.

42:39
Brian asked this nerdiest turtle question.  Like, oh God, he  goes, he goes, I'm just wondering who, who is it that came up with the different turtles, uh, mass colors when the cartoon started. And I'm like,  oh, dying a little bit. uh And Kevin did his credit was just like, he's like, you know, that's a good question. I'm not really sure. It's probably the toy company, but, uh, cause we're still nerds. We can't turn it off.  Sometimes we try to, you know, act like we aren't nerds.

43:08
and Ken will be like, relax, you're not a fan, you're professional. But it's hard to turn it off. I my whole office is full of turtles. Aaron, I am admiring your studio and back. mean, as someone that has a bunch of stuff behind me and all my figures and toys, I'm like, keep going, Aaron, keep talking. Let me see what this Godzilla shelf looks like. If you're on video watching this.

43:35
For my audio listeners uh toys on toys on toys on toys on shelves of toys so many TMNT figures I'm  I I was green of envy, but now all I see is green. It's awesome. Do you got a lot of comps? Not really. I mean I get if I make something I work on something I usually get one but what's on the shelves here? There's a shelf of Ghostbusters stuff because my boss and I are both huge Ghostbusters fans. So there's a

44:01
There's a Ghostbusters shelf and then there's a turtle shelf over there. And then there's just more turtles everywhere. The thing about like, once you start working here, I have a, I'm in LA, so we have a small apartment because apartments are insane. So there's not room for a bunch of stuff, but in the office, we share office space with the company that does a lot of Disney stuff, but we've kind of taken over a lot of the space. So we just have NECA turtles everywhere. There's just, but my boss, he's been in the toy industry for, I don't know, a couple of decades. And he's also a

44:30
like a fan of stuff. So he's got his personal collection of like he man toys and there's some Batman stuff. We just there's toys everywhere. They're all over the place. It's you know, they're just like piles and piles of toys. And the stuff before you like before I started working here, you're a fan. You're like, oh, that's a prototype. That's a it's a test shot. Those things are really weird.  They're just all over the office because it's part of the toy making process. So there's like I've got test shots and prototypes on my shelf over here that

45:00
Like if you don't work for a toy company, these things are like rare and expensive. And once you work there, it's like it's just another so common part of the process. Yeah, it's it's like we actually need to sweep this shit up. It's getting dirty. Exactly. they break and you're like, oh, shit, that broke. It's it's. I got you. You talked about, you know, being a fan and I'm thinking about.

45:27
Just how diehard and dedicated um I think  the TMNT fandom is.  And I think that's kind of like a blanket statement that could be applied for anything, know, Star Wars fans, Star Trek fans, comic book fans. But there's something special about, I think, TMNT fans.  And I can't quite put  words to it right now. And Aaron, I could use your help  kind of explaining from your perspective as someone that is a giant fan himself that now works.

45:54
uh within the industry and you know, and honestly, Aaron,  your name has some weight among the TMNT fans as well as specifically the toy collector fans. Some of the first, the top results on Google when I Googled your name were Reddit threads. They were like, uh I wanna say they were either NECA subreddit threads or just TMNT  subreddit threads where people are like, hey,

46:18
New box art by Aaron Hazory came out. Do you think we'll get  this Donatello lab figure? It's like all of these, like people are studying your box art and the things that you post on your personal Facebook, trying to figure out what's gonna be the next Neko release or toy release. And I think that's so fucking fascinating. And maybe that's how I encapsulate the TMNT  fandom is that they're very hungry for all things turtles. And you're like, man, this thing has been going on since.

46:45
What 1984 is when the turtles made his debut  and  it just feels like there is just an unquenchable thirst. mean, from your perspective, how would you just what makes TMNT fans so different from all the other fandoms out there? What makes them special? I think there's a couple of things with Turtles. A lot of us who are artists were in the Turtles because um it was so art driven back then. I even as a kid, I knew that this was different from like Batman or something because the Batman and

47:13
X-Men, whatever that stuff was cool. But Turtles was like these guys were artists that were different than typical comic book artists. They were telling a different kind of story. Because I mean, my dad was buying me the black and white comics when I was like 10.  I was really young. was before the movie came out. So, gosh, I'm younger than 10.  By the time the movie was out, I knew the story was from the old comics. So a lot of us, I think, were like into it because of the independent nature of the comics back then. And the toys were

47:41
so much weirder than anything else that was out. mean, if you looked at like He-Man or G.I. Joe or even Ghostbusters, that stuff was, it was fun, but it wasn't as weird as the turtle stuff. The turtle stuff was just so off the wall. was crazy. And I think most of us that got into it back then kind of outgrew a lot of other stuff, but we stuck with turtles because it was just so weird and so different. And for people like me that are artists, and there's a ton of us that are artists, we were really drawn to the independent aspect.

48:11
The fact that with Batman back then or X-Men or whatever it is, most of the stuff that was out there looked the same. You get a Batman t-shirt, you get a Batman toothbrush, whatever. It all looked pretty similar. Turtles was so different. Every Turtles thing looked different. They would always get different artists to do the stuff. And so all of it looked different. The board game was different from the coloring books, which is different from the cereal, which is different. So it all looks so different. That's what drew me into it. And I know that's what drew other people into it. And it just...

48:41
Such a different thing. the other thing, and I've talked to some of the Turtles artists about this, it was one of the only things,  one the only properties that supported both the serious take and a crazy like Looney Tunes style take. You could do both with the Turtles. You didn't really do that with Batman. They've done some humor things with Batman more recently, but, or, you know, X-Men or something. They tried it with Thundercats and that didn't go too well. But Turtles seems to like survive anything you do to it.

49:09
can be serious like last Ronin. It can be crazy like rise of the turtles. It could just be like off the wall. can be it can be almost anything that you bring to it. can the turtles can reflect it. So it supports almost anybody's take. I think that's why there's so many fans, because you can be like a mom in her 40s and still be a Turtles fan because it's still cute and so wholesome enough for your kids. Or you can be like a like a 20 year old dude that's covered in tattoos and he's in heavy metal and he's in the old school like

49:39
like Blood Guts Turtles. It's  so  different. Anybody can, whatever they bring to it, will kind of, turtles will kind of reflect it and support it. That was excellently said because I have met that wide range of fandom. To your credit, I have met, you know, the gruffest looking guy in the world that fucking loves, you know, the original Mirage comics, you know, Mirage Studios comics to, you know, uh hell, like  one of my nephews, huge turtle fan because of the latest iteration.

50:09
Yeah, you're right. There is something about the turtles that has made them survive throughout the times, adaptable to different,  you know, wherever we're at, you know, as a society and culture, I think the turtles have kind of adapted to that while still maintaining the integrity of them being, you know,  the brotherhood. For me, it's the brotherhood aspect of someone that grew up with four brothers. TMNT at one point before we had uh David, youngest, our youngest brother, join us. Like TMNT was the only group that each one of us

50:37
You know, there's like one for each one of us. It was like, holy shit, there's four brothers in this cartoon and we don't have to share a character. So that for me is one of the biggest draws. Aaron, with that being said, I want to move into a segment of the show that I like to do anytime I have a guest. It's called the Short Box Friends and Family Segment. It's where I shut up for a little bit  and I let someone else ask the questions.  And in your case, I was able to reach out to two different individuals to submit a question for you for this interview.

51:07
The first one comes from someone that we have brought up that you have brought up a few times already. So here is your first surprise voicemail. So this is Brian Van Hooker from the Turtle Tracks podcast. know Aaron is a great visual artist, but I've heard that his secret talent that he's a bit modest about is he's really accomplished singer. I'm wondering if he can name his favorite song from the Ninja Turtles coming out of their shells tour and even sing a couple of verses.

51:35
He might take a little insisting on this, but I think he'll be great at it. Okay, obviously that was Brian Van Hooker He is the host  of the turtle tracks podcast, which is apparently the only interview based Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles podcast They have conversations with TMNT filmmakers actors artists people like Aaron and so much more big shoutouts to Brian for submitting this voicemail  Aaron his question uh You got to set up pipes on you. I didn't know that well

52:01
No, I don't have a set of pipes. I don't know where Brian has heard this from. And if there's things that Brian and I have discussed in private, those will stay private. Right is really a great guy. He's a truly great guy. He's like, I've met him first out here in like a bar someplace. Let tell you about Brian before I answer his question. Brian, I met because he was out here visiting some people. Brian is a writer. He's he was, I think, out here trying to drum up writing work or something.

52:31
It was was must have been right after COVID. I can't remember what it was. was around COVID right afterwards. And I don't remember how we knew each other because like, hey, do you want to meet at a drink or something? I said, sure. So I brought a bunch of my turtles art, like not my stuff, but but vintage art that I own in the cereal box art. So we're in this bar flipping through this this turtles artwork, like two nerds. it's it's it's L.A. It's Burma. So nobody cares.

53:01
But that was when I first met Brian. So Brian and I are, we're great friends, but he's also like, he's a really great guy. His podcast is fantastic. He's got well over a hundred episodes and he has talked to every Turtles person out there. So as far as this coming out of their shells, how can you pick a favorite song? They're all so good. mean, Walk Straight, Skipping Stones, Cowabunga, you know.

53:31
You can count on us. I couldn't pick a favorite one. And am certainly not going to sing any of those songs either in public or in private. Brian's out of his mind. We have occasionally, Brian and  I, indulged in the rare adult beverage and had heated discussions about things like turtles and cartoons. But those will remain private to Brian and I. Well, how about this on the topic of  turtles related songs?  Two days ago, December 13th,

54:01
was  the 38 year anniversary of the 1987 Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles animated series.  I ended up learning that the song, the theme song was done by uh an individual by the name of Chuck Laurie, who also created uh Big Bang Theory and Two and a Half Men among  some other shows. But I did not know that the character that Charlie Sheen plays in Two and a Half Men is loosely based on Chuck Laurie's life.

54:30
someone that makes theme songs for children's cartoon shows.  And I guess him and uh Charlie Sheen kind of like got pretty close over the fact that, you know, he's kind of  portraying him in this light. So  that's your fun fact. Have you ever had a chance to meet anyone that worked on the original uh animated series? Have you had a chance to meet Chuck Lorre at all? Well, I'll tell you a about Chuck Lorre. When I was teaching out here, um I was at a school in LA, ah really rough neighborhood, and the charter was a charter school and the charter organization had

54:59
some kind of fundraising thing. And it was after I had left, but uh they knew me well enough, knew that I was a turtle fan, knew what I was working on. they somehow got Chuck Lorre out there as a donor for this thing they were doing at the school. he, to the kids, now the kids were all very small, elementary school. So they had never seen the old show. They had no idea. I don't think Chuck  was aware of this.  So he told everyone, hey, this is, was, I wrote the original.

55:26
Turtles theme song and he sang a few bars from it and one of the admin at the school recorded it for me on her cell phone and then texted me the video so that was it was really cool so I haven't met him but we have like this tenuous um connection and  I don't know if you've learned this in your research but as far as I know he was never paid for it um so he didn't make a dime off of that.  Wow damn that sucks. He was never paid for it. In fact

55:53
On the vanity card to one of the episodes of  Two and a Half Men, believe he wrote in some detail. I don't think he named the turtles, but I think he kind of explained the whole situation. Oh, whoa. I gotta find that. Without naming names. But yeah, I don't think he was paid for. Damn. Come on, guys. Pay my man. I mean, when the evil shredder attacks, these turtle boys don't cut him no slack. I love that line. Pay my man Chuck Lorre. OK.

56:18
Big shout out to Brian Van Hooker for that first voicemail. I got one more voicemail for you, Aaron. And I know for a fact you'll recognize this voice. Here we go. Hey, Aaron. It's your cousin, Daniel, from Jacksonville, owner of Black Cat Comics. uh You know, whenever Botter suggested that I send in a voicemail to the show and ask you a question, so many different things went through my head. I thought I could keep it like...

56:46
Super underground and talk about toaster guy.  And then I thought  maybe we'll do some TMNT  movie questions. And then I thought about it and we got to give the people what they really want to know. And that is give me a comic book that you passed up on the new release shelves  that you really regretted not picking up. I'd love to hear your answer. All right. That's all I got. See you later. Bye. Big shout outs to Dan.

57:14
owner of Black Cat Comics where Aaron is doing a signing this Saturday, December 20th. I had no idea that you guys were familiar. I didn't know that he was your cousin. I was like, that's super cool. It runs in the family. You had a talented as artist  and the owner of one of the best up and coming comic shops here in Jackson. Daniel's great. I was gonna say he's a great kid, but he's not a kid anymore. It's hard to,  I still remember him as the kid that my brother would play with. They'd be playing Super Nintendo until two in the morning. um

57:43
Let me think, what do I regret passing up? I don't read a ton of comics because we get all the turtle stuff here. They send it to us. So  I don't really miss like I don't nothing gets passed as we see it all. But you know what I do regret not getting this is this goes back a little bit. But a few years ago before Nickelodeon bought the turtles, Peter Laird was putting out his own turtle comics and almost nobody was buying. So they were like really, really low print runs and they're really hard to get now. And so those stories are hard to find.

58:11
hard to read. that's I really regret passing those up because I think there was some cool stuff in those books. And at the time, I would have been into it. And now I wish I had those things to read because, you know, I  think it would be really, really cool books, but they're hard to get. And as far as newer stuff, I don't know, I don't  read as many comics as I used to.  least not new stuff. I buy lot of older stuff. But that's a tough question.  What's the last like, whether it be Turtles, or just comic in general, what's the last?

58:39
thing, a comic related thing that you bought that  you were pretty like hype about? Well, you know, because I'm doing some of the covers for it, I've been buying the Turtle Saturday Morning Adventures comics because I just did  one cover. I don't know if I  said this, yeah, this would be exclusive for the podcast. But I'm doing a second Turtle Saturday Morning Adventures cover that will be out in  my first one's out in January. I think this one will be out either in March or April.

59:07
I need to finish. It's actually on my drawing table now. I need to get it finished. as soon as we're done here, I'll be using that as my second cover. Well, I was going to say on the topic of that, I probably, to Dan's credit, I probably should give the people what they want, ask a comic related question here. You've done, aside from tons of packaging art and box art for the various NECA team and T-figures, you are, it sounds like getting back into doing more comic book and cover work.

59:35
Like you said, you've got your TMNT Saturday Morning Adventures issue number 33. I had no idea the series has been going on that long. But you've got a variant cover for issue 33, which comes out January 28th. You've also done like a pinup in the 40th anniversary comic celebration, the TMNT 40th anniversary comic celebration, hardcover that came out. What other comic related things have you done in the past couple of years that are whatever, TMNT related or not TMNT related?

01:00:06
I did a cover for the 40th anniversary  special, which I'll have with me at the signing Saturday. It's only thing I think I'll have.  But I did the cover for that and I've colored some of Ken Metroni's  covers. He's done a couple of covers for the different turtle books. So I've colored those for Ken, which is funny since I'm colorblind, but I just kind of fell into that. And ah I've also done a, what was the last thing? I'm working on a cover for something called Mutant.

01:00:34
Multiverse, which is not turtles, but there's a toy line that uh, is it called treasure house? I think has launched this toy line called mutant multiverse and it's a bunch of characters that have been created by some of the turtles guys jim lawson and dan burger and Um, maybe eric talbot some of those guys They're doing some old,  uh Unused designs from the playmates toy line. They're turning those into toys So I just finished up a cover for that book, which i'm not sure when that'll be out

01:01:04
Um, and can find them on Instagram. guess, uh, does it feel like you are, yeah, I said you're getting back into comic book work, but I mean, if we're looking at,  if we're really looking at it's like, you never really left. It's just like the medium  has changed. Does that feel like that for you? Like, are you excited about, you know, uh, getting back into doing more comic book centric work and covers and things like that?  Or are you, or do you see it all as like one kind of like thing? Hey, I just do art. Well, for me, it's like,

01:01:33
I love comics, I love drawing comics, but there is  so little money in it for the amount of work you have to do that it doesn't make any sense to do it as like a regular thing. I mean, I've had people ask me, don't you do the whatever the Saturday morning comic, which is split between two artists, think Sarah Myers and  Dan Shoning, I think are the two artists on that book. It's so much work  and it just  there's just no time because I do have a regular job now. So there's just no time to do interiors for anything. The covers are fun to do. It's

01:02:03
not as much work. You get to draw characters you might not normally get to draw. And it's just kind of a fun thing to do. Nowadays, they do variants for almost every book. It used to not be as common, but now it's like for almost every book. And the retailer variants are like everywhere now too. So it's not that hard to, if you really want to do these, find someone that's willing to either hire you to do it or let you do a cover for them. And so I would always,

01:02:32
love to do more comic stuff. It's just mostly a time thing. Honestly, it takes so much time. And the day job is a day job. You don't want to spend every waking moment drawing. You got to go outside. Yeah, got to touch grass every now and then. Yeah, but I love doing comics. So I would love to do more comics, more turtle stuff, of course, but non-turtle stuff would be fun too. So as it comes along, I'm happy to do that kind of stuff. I love getting the opportunity to work on anything comic related.

01:03:02
I don't have the time for it. It's just such a time intensive thing. And I would love to my own stuff. But again, it's just a time thing. There's just never any time. You're speaking to the choir. But on that same breath, hashtag bring back Toaster Guy comics, Aaron. I backed the first volume of Toaster Guy back in the day. I think I might have backed the second volume. So all I'm saying is don't be surprised if I come to you at the signing and ask for a Toaster Guy sketch in some way. Toaster Guy was fun, but there was a couple of things happened.

01:03:32
One is all the comparisons to powder toast man just got awesome. Just exhausting and to someone on web tune two years ago, put out something called toaster dude or something. And it was basically that it was a guy in a cape and a red outfit and  had a toaster for a head.  And it kind of just took the wind out of my sails. Like this guy's and he had like, I don't know, 50,000 followers or something. I said, I don't want to do this because it's gonna look I'm chasing them. So if I do my own stuff again, it probably won't be toasting.

01:04:02
So he was fun to do. Um, and I don't regret doing it, but not long ago, I actually threw out all my toaster guy. had a banner and I had a cutout and I just was like, you know what? I think it's time to move on. So I, I trashed all that stuff. So I'll do my own stuff again with it, but it probably won't be toaster. That's fair. Hey, on to bigger and brighter things.  Aaron, before we wrap up this episode, I almost, I feel compelled or I feel remissed if I didn't ask one of the most basic questions when it comes to TMNT.

01:04:30
Which is, who's your favorite turtle? But I want to rephrase that in a way. And I want to know which turtle resonates with you the most. Like which one is most like you personality wise? Which one do you feel like represents you the best? Whether it be your favorite or opposite of that. Probably Michelangelo because we eat pizza a lot here at the office. Hey, great answer.

01:04:59
And in that regard, think I might be like Michelangelo too. I've had pizza for the last three days in a row.  I was thinking about that question. mean, most people will know. I mean, I literally have a Leonardo figure on my desk right now.  Leonardo is my favorite, but I started thinking, I think if I was to ask more people like, hey, which turtle do I remind you of the most? I think more people would say Donatello. I'm a  techie, I'm kind of nerdy, uh a little more reserved.

01:05:28
I think Michelangelo and maybe a little bit of Michael. I'm kind of like a goofball. So in reality, I think I'm closer to Donatello and a little bit of Michelangelo. But Leonardo is my favorite. Do you have, does your favorite differ from Michelangelo, your personal favorite? I mean, I don't know if I have a favorite because, you know, you can't really pick a favorite turtle. It depends on your mood and exactly, you know, which version of the turtles honestly, but Michelangelo, it's like I'm kind of lazy. I like to eat pizza. I don't have a favorite.

01:05:57
The most like Michelangelo. Okay. What's your favorite version of Michelangelo? And it could be from the comics, the TV show, the movies, et cetera. So what is your favorite singular version of Michelangelo? Personality wise, it's probably the movies because the movies really got it down, I think. But I love the cartoon one also and the voice, Townsend Coleman, his  Michelangelo was just perfect. Drawing wise, it's got to be the Ken Metroni Archie  TMNT version because his is like

01:06:28
just perfect. was like the cartoon, it had a little bit of like a Warner Brothers animation influence to it. that art wise, that is my favorite uh look for Michelangelo. Solid answers, solid answers. And I think Aaron, the last question I'll ask is you've given a lot of advice, uh a lot of insight into your career and how you landed  this role with NECA and all the great things that you've been doing since then. ah Is there anything that you would add?

01:06:56
considering or keeping in mind that there may be an aspiring artist, illustrator, someone that's looking to also maybe break into the toy industry, do  similar things like you're doing. What advice would you give them? I think the biggest thing, and I've seen some pushback on this from some people, but I think the biggest thing, if you want to draw, draw every day. want to write, write every day. Whatever it is you want to do, do it every day. There's people that go, oh, I don't want to get, what if I get burnt out? If you get burnt out by doing it every day, then it's probably not a job.

01:07:26
because you are gonna have to do it every single day. And I think the other important thing is put it out in front of people so they can see it. And with AI and stuff, people are afraid that, God, my art's gonna get scraped or stolen or whatever. I just the other day saw my stuff on a t-shirt and I've never sold shirts with my art on it. So I don't know how I got there. Somebody stole it, but I don't care. People are gonna steal your stuff if you put it in front of them. It just happens. They're gonna make bootleg hats or stickers or whatever. It's just...

01:07:54
Who cares? They're going to make a few dollars off of it. It doesn't matter. The few dollars they're going to make is not, it's nothing in comparison to who might see your stuff if you put it out there and, you know, make it public, let it, let everybody see it. Cause the more you try to hide your artwork and protect it, the fewer opportunities people are going to have to see it. People that aren't as good as you, but to put their out,  their art out there are going to get those opportunities. You may be an incredible.

01:08:21
illustrator, musician, whatever. But if the stuff is at home, where only you and your friends can see it, it's not gonna do you any good. You gotta make stuff, you gotta put it out where people can see it, and then move on. Ignore the comments, even the positive comments, because people are gonna wanna, know, hype you up. And that's great, except your work may not be where it needs to be to get hyped up. So um ignore,  maybe not ignore the comments, but consider the source of the comments. And if it's coming from somebody that knows

01:08:51
talking about then yeah, definitely take that comment. But otherwise just kind of ignore most of that noise. I'll say one other thing. I was, this must have been when I first got to LA, was at a comic book show next to a comic book editor named Barbara Keisel, I think it was her last name. And she edited for DC and I think maybe Marvel, I don't know, but she was an editor for a long time. She was looking at my stuff. She said, this is good, but remember that the wrong line drawn confidently.

01:09:20
looks better than the right line drawn like with some nervousness. And she wasn't wrong. You know, it was something Ken Mitrony told me later on was just like, draw it. Don't question it. Don't fuss over it. Just get in there and draw. And that's a big thing. If you're to draw, draw confidently. Practice what you're doing, but don't like be nervous with your drawing or it's going to look like you're afraid and don't know what you're doing. So here's my advice as both an artist and a former art teacher. Solid advice.

01:09:49
And with that being said, ladies and gents, this is the Short Box podcast. And we just finished talking to Aaron Azori about,  man, a lot. We talked about NECA toys. We talked plenty about TMNT and the turtles. We even got to talk about Sesame Street. We talked about art advice. We talked about a lot. All right. And I'm to have links to Aaron's social media. I'm going have links to his Instagram.  He posts a lot of his art as well as packaging concepts and things like that coming out through NECA. So if you're a collector, great way to stay up to date.

01:10:16
And once again, he's gonna be at Black Cat Comics here in Jacksonville, on December 20th from 11 a.m. to 2 p.m. Come on out, man. Get something signed. All right, I feel like your figure is worth one thing, but after being signed by Aaron, all right, that could put your kids through college. Consider coming out, getting something signed from Aaron, getting a sketch and all of that. And big shout outs to both Brian and Dan for submitting voicemails this episode.

01:10:43
Aaron, this has been great. Do you have any parting words, any shameless plugs before we wrap up anything we didn't cover?  No plugs, but thanks so much for having me on. Congrats again for 13 years. That's impressive. Thank you for being a part of Short Box History and Lore. And thanks for uh making  this second interview even better than the first.  Thank you so much.