Mike Del Mundo 0:00

In this episode of the short box. My entry into hip hop was like from 1993 and up. So I grew up with, you know, Ilmatic, basically. Like Ilmatic is like my top, it's gotta be like my my top two favorite albums. Yeah. I would just say top one. Yeah. My favorite album, basically.

Badr Milligan 0:19

You're like it's top two and it's not two.

Mike Del Mundo 0:22

It's in between, it's it's between Ilmatic and um the infamous. So um but yeah, man, that's like that's a dream, dream, dream.

Intro music 0:32

Ladies and gentlemen, short box podcast is recorded live from Jacksonville Floor.

Badr Milligan 0:57

Short Box Nation, hello again. Welcome back, and thanks for pressing play today. If you're brand new, welcome to the show. I'm your host, Badr Milligan, and this is the Short Box Podcast, the comic book talk show, where we bridge the gap between the panels of your favorite comics with the people who who make said comics, right? The people who put their blood, sweat, and tears into making them. This is episode 501, which makes this the official start of season 11. You guys know the deal by now. Every 50 episodes marks a new season of the short box. And uh we're starting this new one off in a big proper way, okay? We got the return of Mike Del Mundo on the show, all right? For those of you who've been asleep for the last couple of years, Mike Del Mundo is an award-winning Marvel cover artist. He made his short box debut last year on episode 469, which feels like a lifetime ago as we enter 501. Uh, but he's back on the show, all right? He's back on the pod to talk about the upcoming release of his first ever art book, the Marvel Art Mike Del Mundo, it's being released through Clover Press. It was initially launched uh last year as a Kickstarter campaign. It was wildly successful to put it uh lightly, and it's getting a general release to Comic Shops uh later this summer. I think uh July 1st, but who knows, it might be pushed out, but it's coming soon, right? Mike also has two, count 'em, two new sci-fi fantasy one shots that he's doing the interior artwork for, which I think deserves its own like celebration. We get like some new comics by Mike Damon of Interior Art. I mean, come on now. They're coming out on Dark Horse Comics. Uh Foundation is the first one shot. It'll be in Comic Shops on the on July 8th. And then you got Shift, which will be available on September 2nd. Both of these one shots tell the beginnings of the three worlds, three moons. Uh, it's it's the collaborative sci-fi fantasy universe created by Jonathan Hickman, Nick Spencer, obviously Mike Domundo's involved, and Mike Huddleston. All right, this has been a uh it's been on Sub Stack, all right? It was it was born on Stub Stack, it's been on Sub Stack for a while. It's finally getting a general release later this uh later this summer, like the dates I just mentioned. So uh we got a lot to talk about. And it's and because it's Mike Domundo, you know that we'll be talking about hip hop this episode. So we got plenty to cover today. But before we get started on that, I want to give special recognition to our amazing sponsors who help us keep the lights on, right? Big shout out to our presenting sponsor, CoverPrice.com, the ultimate comic book price guide and collection management tool for comic collectors. CoverPrice does all the hard work of telling you what your collection is worth right now. Get cover price for one dollar for one month by using the special promo code in this episode's show notes. Just click the link in the show notes and enjoy using coverprice.com for one month for one dollar. And we can't talk about sponsors and not show some love to Gotham City Limit Comic Shop. It's the best comic shop in Northeast Florida, it's my local comic shop. If you live in Jacksonville like I do, you can go visit them today on Southside Boulevard, or you could just buy comics from them online at GothamCityLimit.com. Those are our sponsors, they're great. Big shout outs to CoverPrice.com, big shout out to Gotham City Limit, and of course, big shout outs to the Patronis, right? The loyal supporters over on the short box Patreon. You guys are the best. Now, without further ado, let's bring on our guest of honor today, dropping a new art book, showcasing some of the finest covers who ever graced Marvel Comics. You can quote me on that. Let's give it up for Mike Del Mundo, everybody. What up, Mike? How you doing? Welcome back, man. Glad to have you back. Yeah, man. Yo, how you feeling today? How you doing today?

Mike Del Mundo 4:31

Feeling uh feeling pretty good. I mean, aside from the allergies, seasonal allergies. Oh, yeah, they're here for fourth. Yeah, yeah, it's it's I it feels like it's like the worst year ever. But um, I popped a few antihistamines, so I'm good.

Badr Milligan 4:46

Yeah, don't fall asleep on me, Mike. I need you just for a strong 45.

Mike Del Mundo 4:50

No, no, no, it doesn't it definitely doesn't affect my drowsiness. Yeah. Um, no, it's good, it's good. Although, like, I think a few days ago I had like a drink downtown, and um, I forgot I had I took one, and like that messed me up for some reason. It got me really sleepy and all that stuff.

Badr Milligan 5:09

I think if you look on the pill bottle, uh it says not to mix alcohol with the medication.

Mike Del Mundo 5:14

Yeah, just have one drink, you know?

Badr Milligan 5:16

Oh yeah, it always starts like that. Mike, what's uh uh you had a watering hole, you got like a go-to bar that you like going to?

Mike Del Mundo 5:23

No, I'm not like a like a like a frequent bar guy. Um that was I was actually just met up with uh a couple art guy, art friends. Cool. Um so that was a sporadic moment. Usually we're just kind of stuck isolated in this cave.

Badr Milligan 5:40

You know, yeah, yeah. It's a very uh very lonely uh uh career you got. I guess how do you how often do you meet up with like other art friends or are you always like at least maybe emailing, texting, like stuff like that?

Mike Del Mundo 5:52

I think the the main artist that I talk to a lot is Sanford Green. Oh, cool. So he's all the way up in South Carolina, so but whenever we get a chance, we'll uh we'll we'll talk online and yeah, it's a nice uh it's a nice conversation about uh you know comics or hip-hop debates, you know. We get into it pretty hard. What's the last like big hip-hop debate you had? Um yeah, we get into it, bro. Because they the the I I can't remember the last thing, but well, we we debate a lot because I guess like we're different generations of hip-hop. So he's a bit older and he's he's grown up with like you know, the LLs and the Rocky. Sure, yeah, the golden age. I'm more like the um, you know, 93 and up.

Badr Milligan 6:35

Yeah, this the second golden age. Like, you can't go wrong with either or, but yeah, I I guess it is with hip-hop being so young, I do think like those minor year differences do play like a big part, right? Like, I I came in like you know, in 2004, 2005, but I started like in the mid-90s stuff. So like Ilmatic, Reasonable Doubt, and then I kind of did my homework backwards, and I'm actually wearing a Rak Kim shirt, but like I did like the homework of Rak Kim and and all of like those other like uh like that second wave. I think LL and them are you know the Def Jam era was like kind of the second wave before that was like the Cold Crush Brothers, you know, Grandmaster Flash and all that.

Mike Del Mundo 7:13

Yeah, same same thing. I I I went back, I went back and did my homework. Um Rock Kim actually was like it was huge because when we were breaking, a lot of his music was part of the dance. So that's how we got accustomed to well. Um like that's how I got accustomed to Rockham and just started going back into his albums. Yeah.

Badr Milligan 7:37

I Mike, I know that we talked about your B-boy origins uh the la last year when you were on the pod. But but what I don't know if I ever had a chance to ask you what are some of your favorite, I guess what was some of your favorite songs to to break dance to? Like, were there was there any particular songs that you were like, yo, this is my jam, this is why I go all out?

Mike Del Mundo 7:55

Yeah, like uh anything by like James Brown, like get on the good foot. Um, and then obviously Apache, that's everyone's favorite. Yeah, and um I don't know, there's this one track uh that all the b-boys know, uh Babe Ruth. Hold on a second. By the Mexican, I believe. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Badr Milligan 8:16

Actually, I pulled it up right here.

Mike Del Mundo 8:17

I'm gonna play it just through my Yeah. So it's the Mexican by Babe Ruth, and like that, it's it's it's a it's a crazy trick. I'm definitely familiar with this sample for sure.

Badr Milligan 8:26

My man DJ B. Ryan, I'll never forget going to this was years ago. Uh he's he was part of this group called the Little Green Apples, and they were a DJ crew. B-boys were involved, and they threw like this super dope event called Summer in the City, or it was part of like the Summer in the City event. And uh he was spinning, they had uh B-boys on this stage dancing, and I mean the mix that he played was incredible. Like at the time I thought I knew about like, you know, these like deep cut, these deep soul cuts and funk cuts, but like getting into the the the b-boy like side of hip-hop and like exploring like such a like the really deep cuts when it comes to like funk and soul and the stuff that's a little more a beat, that's more danceable. It's like a whole different world out there.

Mike Del Mundo 9:11

That's another thing. Like, um, like you said, you you went back and you did your uh your knowledge on like Eric B and Rock Him. Like as a B-boy, like we got you know exposed to like all the deep cuts, like funk and soul, all the stuff from the 70s. Yeah, it's not so yeah. I mean it's it's it's uh it was pretty nice to to grow up in that time, you know.

Badr Milligan 9:32

Hell yeah. Mike, we hit the ground run. I look, uh, this won't be the last time that we talk Avop or music, but I want to shift gears because uh, you know, preparing for this episode, it you know had me a little nostalgia. I I went back to our first episode. Um, and and the big talking point that episode, you came on the show to promote the Kickstarter for the Marvel Art of Mike Del Mundo, your first ever art book that was being put out by by Clover Press. Um at the time the Kickstarter had it even launched. I think I dropped the episode the same day that the Kickstarter launched. So I was like kind of tuned, yeah, I was like tuned in. I think, you know, to help the promotion out and you know get the word out, which I mean, if I'm being honest, you had you needed no help from me for that Kickstarter to be successful. Um it's been nine months now since the Kickstarter campaign for the art book ended. It ran for a month, I think mid-August to like mid-September is when it ended. And if I remember correctly, it was your first Kickstarter campaign. Uh, I think you were just a little nervous about like what to expect. You had like talked to a bunch of other people that did Kickstarters. So you were like, you know, gonna experience this for yourself. And you were, I think at the time, just like, hey, if we hit our goal, I'm more than happy. I'm gonna be humble about it. Well, if you go on the Kickstarter webpage now, it says 975 backers pledged $143,465 to help bring this project to life. I don't remember what the initial goal was, but I remember getting a message from someone on YouTube saying, yo, you just dropped this episode. The Kickstarter is 20 minutes in, and it's already double what they initially had. Can you take me back to last August and tell me what you experienced for your first Kickstarter? What was that like? It was a relief.

Mike Del Mundo 11:15

Like, I did have a feeling that like we would do well just because we were working with Clover Press, and Clover Press has done like eight books before that. So they kind of And they're still pumping them out, man.

Badr Milligan 11:27

They're killing it.

Mike Del Mundo 11:27

Yeah, I think they just announced a Mike Zec art book they're putting out, which looks amazing. Yeah, that's I mean, that's amazing. Like they they're beautiful books, and working with Hank, um, which was the lead on the Kickstarter stuff and uh the Marvel art book stuff, I just had confidence. For some reason, this guy doesn't show any fear, he's very chill, calm, and I'm like, all right, cool. I mean, Hank seems like we're gonna do well, we're gonna do well. But I yeah, I did have a lot of confidence in the fact that they they do have this Kickstarter thing down to a science. Yeah, they do so um, but it was still surprising. It was surprising to see the amount of um uh subscribers or people that that uh that bought into the book, the backers. And I was kind of really thankful because like it's not just uh the fans and like the hardcore like readers of art, but the whole community came and like supported like my family, my friends, like people I'd never think, you know. So that was really nice. Really nice to see.

Badr Milligan 12:28

That's awesome. I looked at the um just know this, Mike. Your boy spent a grip to get a nice that like I forgot what tier I was on, but I was like, nah, this is his first art book. I just finished recording you with you. I was like, man, that was one of the best interviews I had. Let me show some like big love on this. So I forgot what tier I signed up for, but I remember thinking like I really fuck with Mike Demondo, I think. So I'm thanks, man. I'm looking forward to uh uh getting my book. I checked on the the Kickstarter today, and that's the thing about Kickstarter, it's one of those things where I I gotta be careful because I'll like support and back a lot of campaigns. And then it's kind of like I already know it's gonna take a while. You know, it's not like an overnight thing, you know, it takes time. There's the production, the shipping, all that stuff. Um, so I'll tend to like just kind of forget it. And this was kind of the case. I was like, wait, did I already get my art book? Is it one of these, like, and one of these boxes that's piling up in my room? And I was like, okay, not yet. I checked the the Kickstarter today. You guys had a post um a couple of days ago that you guys got the printer proofs in. Next steps are actually going to be production and then fulfillment. I know that you know you're probably hands-off on that part. Um, but but I guess what's that part of the process been like? Because I hear from a lot of different creators that it's one thing, it there it's very nerve-wracking to launch the Kickstarter, to promote it. You're spending a lot of time promoting it, hopping on podcasts, doing news interviews, blah, blah, blah. And then it ends, but that's not the last bit of work. Now comes like even more work with the production, the fulfillment. What's the what's that been like?

Mike Del Mundo 13:56

It's been pretty good on our part because we've been working with the publisher Clover Press. Like I said, it's like they have it down to a sign, so they have their designers ready to go. The hardest part for us was uh me and Jay had to just pick the covers, like what's gonna go into the book. So the toughest part was like, I wanted to squeeze everything in there, so we'd have to do a lot of like adding and subtracting. And then I'd I'd I'd do some new covers that I'm like, yo, these covers have to go into this book.

Badr Milligan 14:26

Damn.

Mike Del Mundo 14:26

So there's a lot of covers from um even 2026 that I did that's like we're like last minute putting them in because I'm like, yeah, they gotta go in because this might be the only book, you know.

Badr Milligan 14:37

Would you say that you have enough material for how many more books? Like enough material for one more book, or like, yo, I I can crank out three more of these hype art books with what I got left.

Mike Del Mundo 14:47

Well, I I think maybe another book, but like this book was was the one that encompassed 15 years of it.

Badr Milligan 14:54

Yeah.

Mike Del Mundo 14:55

And um, we really like went in and was like, these are the bangers. Let's just put all the bangers in there. Kind of treated it like uh like a mixtape, you know. Just um You know what?

Badr Milligan 15:06

I I think the mixtape comparison is good, but I I'll do you one better. It's almost like you just dropped your first album. I'm thinking about this Jay-Z quote that he said, uh, it was like this reasonable doubt interview. And he was like, you know, reasonable doubt was 15 years of my life. You know what I'm saying? And I think that's safe to say for any artist that puts out like their first album, like your whole life is leading up to that point. Like that first album encompasses your entire life up to that point. And I think it's probably safe to say for you too, like 15 years of like being in the industry, and you get to like crystallizing 15 years worth of work. Yeah, it's not a bad thing, right? Now I just gotta choose from it all. Yeah. Now, um, I was uh I want to give you and Jason Sorrente, uh your homeboy, uh Jason Sorrenti. Sorinty? Is that how you say Sorrenti? Uh Serenti, I think. Sorrente. Big shout outs to Jason, uh, because he was kind enough to send me a PDF version of the art book. I've been going through it, and what I like about it so far is that it it does have a linear aspect to it. Like um, it starts off with your your um X-Men legacy covers, and now I'm in like the Electra phase, which is special to me because that's when I you know found out about you. That's when I like became a big fan. So I do like so far the linear kind of timeline aspect of it going through your career from the beginning and so forth. Um, I couldn't help though, man. I uh I'm one of these types where I I like reading the I like a good introduction or a good foreword. And the art book has both of those things. It's got an introduction by you, where you're talking about, you know, just inspiration, the support you've had throughout the years through friends and family, art teachers and colleagues, and how that like really inspired you. So I'm I'm gonna pause here and ask my first question. You mentioned how much of an influence your dad was uh in your art journey. You know, like he was a great, he was a pretty good artist himself. You mentioned like you know, remembering the first time he drew, I think, like the TMT or something like that, how that had a profound effect on you. Yeah, has your dad seen the book yet? Like, what's he think about you getting your own art book?

Mike Del Mundo 17:05

Um I think, damn, yeah. I don't think he's seen like the book book yet. Um, but he knows about he knows that we're doing something. He hasn't even seen what I wrote about it, so he's gonna be surprised. That's gonna be awesome.

Badr Milligan 17:19

That's gonna be wow, that's gonna be a moment, man. That's gonna be great. Um so great introduction by you. And then you've got a foreword by Scotty Young. He writes like a it's almost like a two-page foreword, just giving you insane, glowing praise and like that very tongue-in-cheek kind of uh uh jokey manner that he he's known for. How did that come about? Like, did you approach him or vice versa?

Mike Del Mundo 17:42

Yeah, I I approached him. I was I I said, what the heck, man? Like, I love Scotty. Um I mean, he's kind enough to do this. Just I just hit him up and was like, would you be able to do this? He'd be like, and he was like, he was excited. So um yeah, I'm I've known Scotty for man for years now. So um no, it it was it's hard, it's hard to take in because like Scotty is like one of my idols, you know, since like 2000, I don't know, early 2000s, going to San Diego and showing my portfolio to him. Yeah, and then now he's this guy that's like giving me all this praise. So it's really tough to like take it in, you know. But um it's so nice, yeah.

Badr Milligan 18:26

Remind me again, what was the the comic that you drew? Uh you drew your your kids in there, but you also drew uh drew in like a map that his kids did, or you what was the story behind that one?

Mike Del Mundo 18:36

Oh, so this was for uh Strange Academy. Yes. And he wrote about um the Weird World, which is the book that me and Jason Jason Aaron did. And um there's this crude map in Weird World. So initially in the in the the book that me and Jason Aaron did, we did these like crude maps that like were given to like the main character, and they would have to like kind of take it apart and try to make their way through this world, looking at this map that just doesn't make sense. It's like looks like it's drawn by like a child, right? So when we got to Strange Academy and Scotty wanted to revisit it again, I was like, why don't we just why don't I just get my kids to do it since it's like yeah, a child map. So it was fun. Like I just got my kids to just that's cool, do whatever they wanted. So it's like a full out. We actually actually one of my only original pieces. Oh, that's that um, but yeah.

Badr Milligan 19:34

Man, it's it's it seems like art is a family affair for you. If if I recall correctly, your kids also made another appearance in um like this Marvel interview video or this video that they put up on their YouTube channel where they're interviewing you. And I think in the middle of you like talking about your process, like you can hear your kids in the back playing, and you're like, oops, like do y'all need me to cut that out? But they kept it in. I thought that was really that was a smart decision on on their part. But you know, you talk about like your kids being involved, you you know, your dad playing such an inspiration. I think last time we talked, our last episode, you revealed like your dad has posed for a ton of like uh has been like a model for a lot of like the covers that you'll do. Um I guess like what about your mom? I I uh your mom was a teacher, right? Like an art was she an art teacher or a history teacher? My mom was a math teacher. Math teacher, okay.

Mike Del Mundo 20:20

Yeah. What'd she think about your career? Uh she's she's probably proud of it. Oh, that's cute. Yeah. Um, but yeah, she was she's the one that actually like was always putting in my head that it's like because there's times during you know, like my high school and during even college where I wasn't focused on drawing. Like even during high school, it was b-boying and all that. And I think from what she told me, was she wanted to be a painter. Like that was one of the things that she's she wanted to do. Um, but I guess there was no options like that back in the days. It was like go get a job that you know makes money. Support the family. But she would always, you know, ever so often be like, waste the talent, waste the talent. So that got in my head actually um during college. I remember hearing that in my head and being like, I'm gonna revisit this. So, you know, meeting the group of guys that I I met in college and um that drew comics, and I was just like, that kind of like spiraled into my decision to just go at this 100%, you know.

Badr Milligan 21:26

Oh yeah, now look at you. You got this fancy art book coming out fully backed on Kickstarter. Um, I I think it's cool that it's getting the general release, if I'm to understand it right, right? That uh the kick the backers will be getting theirs uh in the next couple weeks, maybe in the next month or so. And then the general release in comic shops, I guess, is going to align pretty closely to that. Is that right? Yeah, yeah. There's a retail version. Okay, there we go.

Mike Del Mundo 21:50

Okay. Yeah, yeah. And it's gonna be an it's gonna be a pretty sweet cover as well.

Badr Milligan 21:54

I do like all the different things. Did they cover that cover already? I think Lunar has what the Wolverine cover?

Mike Del Mundo 22:00

So there's going to be a Wolverine cover for that's the Kickstarter version. And then the retail version will have the Mystique X-Men cover.

Badr Milligan 22:07

Oh, that one is such a great cover, man. Yeah, yeah. I see it here, right here. So direct market gets the Mystique X-Men cover. Uh, there's the Wolverine cover. Um, I'm kind of beating myself up that I didn't get the Electra cover, but I think I got like the sweet Miles Morales slipcase tier cover one. So yeah?

Mike Del Mundo 22:23

Yeah. I think that might come with it. I'm not sure. I see. I think that might have come with the dust jacket.

Badr Milligan 22:29

Oh, dope, dope. Um, one other thing to note that I want to say about the art book is that there is a companion uh uh sketchbook that you did for this that if you read it in in unison, you'll be able to see uh in the uh Marvel art of Mike Del Mondo book, we'll have the finished, you know, published cover, and then the sketchbook, you'll have the rough drafts, the thumbnails, the the covers that didn't make it. And I think that is such a a cool look inside of your artistic process to have it like all bared out. And I gotta say, man, some of the covers that are left that were left on the cutting room floor. I mean, those alone, I mean, you know, these are like thumbnails and rough sketches are amazing. I I guess I think uh uh the Deadpool illustrated covers. There's one page in particular where, you know, in the official art book, it's that the the published cover where it's you know, I think uh um I forgot the name of the character in front. Sawyer, something Sawyer. Oh, Tom Sawyer. Thank you so much. I think it's like Tom Sawyer. Is that Tom Sawyer? I see or Huckleberry Huckleberry Finn, Tom Sawyer, one of those guys, one of those kids is on the cover and he's fishing out like Deadpool from this river, and and Deadpool's got the missile launcher. But then you see the thumbnail, and you've got like four different versions of different ways that Deadpool is planning to blow up this kid with a missile launcher. And it's just interesting to see like where you landed and and how like the final thing came about it. I guess personally speaking, when do you know like a cover is is perfect or or done or right for the job?

Mike Del Mundo 24:01

It's just a feeling. It's like what gets me excited. Like, if this is the cover that gets me really excited and that I want to be published, then I just go for broke on that one. Cool. But back in the days, like uh during the Deathpool days or even the X-Men Legacy days or the lecture days, I was just doing like hundreds of ideas and sketches. I think I was just trying to be as ambitious as possible. Um, but also um I guess I was just like second guessing a lot of things, and I was like, okay, if I do enough ideas, all of these should amount to something. Because I I do remember when I send those ideas in to Marvel, um, I didn't send anything that I didn't want to draw. So if I sent like 10, you know, 10 thumbnails, you were all like all of them would have been, all of them would be good for it. Yeah. So um, because I've made the mistake of sending something that's like, yeah, they're not gonna you're they're not gonna pick this. Yeah, and then they pick it, you know. So um, but yeah, that's the thumbnail, the thumbnail stage is like my favorite stage out of like the the whole process.

Badr Milligan 25:06

Yeah, I could tell you're having a lot of fun with them. Like they're they're loose, they're a little more energetic. I think some of the concepts are a little more bold, a little more brave. I think uh uh to to uh quote something that Scotty Young says in the foreword, he says that a good cover artist or a good cover should have a visual narrative and a strong concept. Anything, if a cover doesn't have that, then it's just like a pinup of the character. And he goes on to say that you've got that like in spades. And and I co-signed it, man. Uh going through this book, there are covers that I know I've looked at a hundred times, but I think what this book also spotlights is the replayability of your covers, that you can go back to some of them and you're catching new things. For example, um I brought up that Electra series, which is one of my favorite series on Electra issue three, I think it's her swimming in a cave. And at first it's like, oh, this is a really cool concept, but I don't know how I miss that. She's swimming in a psi-shaped, like underwater cave tunnel while also holding a psi. You know, it was like just like a double entendre going on here. Double entendre. Yeah, that's crazy. There's a lot of it's like inception, that kind of inception. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Was there any, I guess, um, in during the process of of you know, trying to slim down and make the selections for the book, what was one or two that you knew you had to add that might have like had a special spot, personal spot in your heart that you're like, this has got to make it.

Mike Del Mundo 26:33

Oh, this the mystique cover for sure. And the any of the X-Men Legacy covers, because like I I was like, I need to put all these covers in there just because I think that was like my jumping off point. For sure.

Badr Milligan 26:48

I think you became a household name with those like X-Men Legacy covers. I think it's real safe to say. I think I put you on the map for sure.

Mike Del Mundo 26:54

Yeah, I was already like I was already doing a lot of covers before that, um before that series, but for some reason, X-Men Legacy, I don't think I've done anything topically the same as that um since. Not not to say that like there I haven't done anything weird, but X-Men Legacy was just crazy weird and it was like perfect timing for me. And like the funny thing too is like I I almost like I actually declined the the work because I was getting married at that time and it was all overlapping. So I remember telling Daniel, Daniel catch him at the the editor. Um, hey, I can't take this job. And I didn't know what to expect with this um with this book. I thought it was just gonna be a regular like let's just do X-Men stuff.

Badr Milligan 27:43

Yeah.

Mike Del Mundo 27:43

But it became like, you know, my own thing. Um, and I was really able to, you know, flourish and like put all my thoughts and like ideas into these books. So um yeah, it was special. And then after that, it just seemed like all the editors were like coming at me, like, yeah, yeah, do this cover and do it, do it, you know, do whatever you need to do with it. Uh you know, they weren't like they were never hands-on, they were just like, Yeah, we trust you. So that was that's what I mean about the jumping off point, is that from then on it was like, you know, I was able to just kind of work my brain and they trusted it.

Badr Milligan 28:19

Yeah, I I think I think that that we what's you know, go back with Scotty say that visual narrative and like that concept. I think you've got I definitely think you've got those two things in spade. And it's kind of like your signature, like aside from like the visual aesthetic of of your work. Um, I think you've you've mentioned before, like that you have like this dry ice effect that kind of makes your work stand out. Um but I also think it's the I think it's like that that concept. Like you your signature, aside from the visual look, it's like there's always going to be a dope concept. And even if you don't get it at first, there's something there, and maybe you just gotta study a little more. Like I mentioned, like the double entendres. I do like catching like how certain things have like double meaning. Um, you brought up the X-Men Legacy uh covers you've done, and there's one I had never seen before. And I spent, I swear, like a good 15 minutes just on this one page. But it's the cover where it's Legion sitting and he's being painted, but like the way that the the the artist is holding the paintbrush from this first person point of view, like the way you play around with Legions, like you know, uh uh high top, it's like, man, so much things uh are going on. How difficult is it? I guess how difficult is a cover like that where there's a lot of different, like you're almost breaking like the fourth wall, and you're you know, you got all these these Easter eggs. Is there one cover in particular that you remember being really difficult to nail like a concept like that? You mean like um after the idea is done or just coming up with the idea? I guess both. Yeah, uh now that you bring it up, what's been the most challenging uh cover to come up with an idea for? And then I guess what's been the most challenging one to actually execute?

Mike Del Mundo 30:00

I found like X-Men Legacy for sure was like in terms of ideas, there's nothing really challenging about it just because just the subject matter and this person made it so easy to like come up with like so many ideas. Um, I think it gets challenging when there's not much like I I need a story, some sort of background, some sort of lore in order to like conceptualize certain certain ideas to get my brain going. Yeah, sometimes if it's just like it's hard to explain, but I would say okay, there's one cover I've done that's uh just like an iconic cover, and I I love it just because of the movement and the energy, and like I just focused on the colors and just the dynamism of it. But there's no um, there's no idea process in it. That was the beta ray. There's a beta ray bill cover I did. I don't know. You already know I'm looking this up on my side.

Badr Milligan 30:53

Okay, uh, so beta ray bill issue three. Yeah, issue three, volume one, issue three. This is a very it's got like the tri like the signature color palette of yours, and once again that dry ice effect.

Mike Del Mundo 31:07

And there was not much like it was a variant cover, and I I guess the story hasn't hadn't come out yet. And it was Beta Ray Bill, and I'm like, I was like, I can't think of anything for this. So that was the one cover that like was tough, just tough to kind of work a an idea around. I'm sure I could have, but like um, I guess I was also in the in the zone of like I want to I just want to do something cool sometimes, you know, like just like a nice cool pose. A good splash page, a good pinup, yeah. So like I can't think about like how tough it is to come up with ideas because most of the time, as soon as I start sketching, the ideas just come, you know. Um, but that that's what I can remember. One of the covers that I've done that's like not as uh conceptual driven.

Badr Milligan 31:52

Got it, got it. Can I say uh apparently someone appreciated this cover and just um uh air quotes here the simplicity of it? I think simplicity only because we're talking about you, and this is maybe the most straightforward cover out of all of the ones. But apparently it was uh they use this cover art for a Marvel Snap card, by the way. They use it for uh beta rib bill. That's pretty dope.

Mike Del Mundo 32:11

That was nice, that was nice. And it might be the only cover with beta rib bill with five fingers.

Badr Milligan 32:18

Whoa! They made that mistake one, two, three, four. All right, I gotta make sure that uh Vigo, we can't release this episode until I make sure I buy this comic so that way before it goes up in the speculation.

Mike Del Mundo 32:30

I was like, oh shit, I think I remember, I think I I found out and I was like, uh, it's just too late. It's already printed. I can't go back.

Badr Milligan 32:39

You know, uh can I pivot here real quick? Because I um I'm thinking about something, uh, a quote I read from you in an article. You were you were talking about like looking back at your old art and how that can kind of be difficult at times when can you know if it's old, old art and how you can be maybe a little hypercritical about it because you've progressed and you've improved as an artist, or you should be improving as an artist, right? Um so the art always has room to improve, but uh the art always has room to improve as time goes on, but you said something to the effect of a good idea is timeless. So even though some of your older art might not be your strongest uh um artistically, the concept and the the ideas are usually like good enough to where it's you know it it feels timeless. Do you think that's still true in this case? What was it like? I guess going back through somebody like your like you said, like some of your first major covers for Marvel. Like, did you have any of those feelings? Were you hypercritical at times? Like, did you look at anything and you were like, Yeah, I've come a long way?

Mike Del Mundo 33:38

Yeah, all the time. Like, even stuff I did last year, I'm like, oh man, I don't like that. You know, like it's just the curse of an of an artist. We just keep getting better. Yeah, and I guess that's a good sign that you're getting better and your eyes are getting better and your draftsmanship is getting better, and this and that. Um, so I do all the time cook go back to things and um and I'm just like I cringe. Um, but then there's times where like it all depends. Like if I'm in a good mood, I look back at my at my stuff and I'm like, yeah, this stuff's awesome. You know what I mean? If I'm in a negative mood, it's just like, oh, all this stuff is shit, like just throwing coffee all over it.

Badr Milligan 34:16

One day you're like, I'm the shit. Yeah. Other days you're like, I'm shit.

Mike Del Mundo 34:21

Yeah. But like I remember when I when I first got my first gig at Marvel, and even around that time, I didn't have that confidence that like I was good at this, you know. I felt like I was a hack.

Badr Milligan 34:36

Sure.

Mike Del Mundo 34:37

You know, I was just figuring things out, and I I felt like I just kind of glucked out. Like they somehow, I somehow fooled them into getting me this job.

Badr Milligan 34:47

Yeah.

Mike Del Mundo 34:47

And um, and with all that in mind, um the one thing that I took from because I was working in design before comics. I was actually, it was like a transition. Like I was when I was doing my first covers, I was still working at a design firm um doing all that. So what I remember saying to myself was like, when I start working on these covers, I want to do what I was doing at in design, taking whatever I learned there and then applying it into uh into comic books. So um the main thing was like I always wanted to do the concepts. Yeah, I was like, yeah, I might be a shitty drawer, but like like you said, like the ideas are there. Yeah. So if I can fool people into just looking at that, like focusing on the idea, and it's kind of like a magician, right? You just kind of fool people into like whatever you're doing in the background, and then they don't even notice what's happening, right? So focus on the idea, and you know, everything else they'll probably think is great. Yeah, that's always been the goal, is like concepts for me and ideas.

Badr Milligan 35:52

Let me let me ask you just a random question. What's the last comic cover that that you've seen out in the wild recently? Whatever comes to mind that really impressed you? Because you know, we're talking about all these incredible covers that that that you've done that are collected in this art book. What's the last cover that done by someone else that you've seen that you're like, wow, that stopped you in your tracks? Hmm.

Mike Del Mundo 36:13

There's like 50 artists. I'm just I just drawing blanks. Whenever I'm on a podcast, I'm drawing blanks. It happens, it always happens. Um the one the one cover that that I recently saw, um, not even recent, like this was years ago, but it's always been in my mind, and I guess that's the first thing that came to mind when you asked that was Ryan Stegman's cover of um I don't even know what issue uh book it is. Hit it.

Badr Milligan 36:41

But it has Cyclops beaming on like circle of yes, yeah. Yeah. That one is hold on, let me see if I could find that one. That cover is so fucking cool. I speaking, I'm gonna see if I can find the exact number, but I was I walked into my comic shop one day and Ben goes, Have you seen the previews for next uh whatever? It was like three months out. He's like, Have you seen the previews for the the next issue of X-Men? I was like, No, I'm like, he shows me the cover and it's I was like, How come no one has ever thought of that? Like Cyclops, like kind of doing a spin off his blast. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Mike Del Mundo 37:17

That's like the I wish I thought of that cover.

Badr Milligan 37:19

Okay, oh my god. Like it was the first thing that pops. I typed in Ryan Stegman's Cyclops cover. First thing that pops up. It's X-Men issue 10, which I think came out maybe two years ago or something like that. Man, yeah, it's a great cover.

Mike Del Mundo 37:33

It's it's yeah, it it hits right away and it's like fuck. Like, why hasn't anyone thought of that? Like, why hasn't anyone thought of just like even the way he swished like the beam, you know what I mean? Yeah, like that's that's fucking cool. The second person that comes to mind is who you've been referring to throughout this interview, Scotty Young. You know, that guy's great as great ideas as well.

Badr Milligan 37:59

Yeah, I I feel like Scotty Young brings, and I think it's on purpose too. I don't think it's crazy to say like this comic strip Calvin and Hobbes energy to all of his covers. And I'm always it always stops me in my tracks in the sense of I'm always looking for the punchline. I'm always reading the dialogue and like, you know, what's the the the joke, what's the quip? And nine times out of ten, it's always landing. I'm always like, damn, that's a really funny way to like break the fourth wall. He's always got like a meta commentary on the character or the industry. Um, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Mike Del Mundo 38:31

He's yeah, he's he's had he's got great concepts and so many. He's got a few of those. I wish I I wish I thought of that kind of covers. So shout out Scotty, man.

Badr Milligan 38:41

Big shout out to Scotty Young. All right, Mike. Uh, so what once again, I want to say that the the Marvel art of Mike DelMondo uh will be shipping to Kickstarter backers, I guess, here in the next couple weeks. Like we we said in the beginning, uh you guys got the printer proofs. Next up is is production, shipping, and all of that. But there is going to be a direct market release later this summer. I guess people can be on the lookout for that. If I was you, I'd go to your comic shop right now and tell them to put this book on your pull. I I can see this being a sellout for sure. All right, which brings me, Mike, I want to shift gears to uh some more stuff that you got coming out. I think this is uh for Mike Delmundo fans, this is like a great year. Like we're eating good. We're getting the Marvel art book, we got the sketchbook that'll be coming out. And then we're finally getting your three worlds, three moon stuff. We're getting uh a one shot later in July, uh, the foundation, and then we're getting the uh shift in September. As someone who has been asleep on this three worlds, three moon stuff, only because I was like, I don't feel like making another subscription with Substack, God bless them though. I am so excited is getting a general release because all of the hype I've heard about it that people who are actually, you know, have been with the Substack and been following along, it's like they can't even explain what it's like what it is. They're like, bro, it's an experience. So I went on the Three Worlds, Three Moons Substack yesterday, and I'm like, I thought I was just looking for a comic. You guys have a web store, an app. Um, like, like in terms of like infusing technology with comics, you guys are doing it right. I there's no way I can explain it other than I think people need to just go on the three worlds, three moon substack and just spend some time perusing. But but in your words, what is the three worlds, three moons? I know it's it's sci-fi, it's fantasy. Jonathan Hickman is involved, which was uh enough for me. It's like Hickman and Delmundo, sign me the fuck up. What can people expect? What is the story behind it? Man, I'm gonna I'm gonna ruin this one.

Mike Del Mundo 40:40

Jonathan, Jonathan should be explaining this, yeah, or even Nick, but I'll I'm gonna try. Uh so like all the stories that you've talked about, like shift and foundations, like you said, it jumps back and forth into different times, right? Um, just that's just how Nick and and Jonathan have kind of weaved this thing together and it somehow all comes together. Um but when we first started Three Worlds Three Moons, it was like almost like prepping people for the main story. So that's like three years of us doing that. It's been three years. Yeah, it's been three years. So if you go on like the Substack site, um like you said, you saw like we've done a whole yeah, it's not just comics anymore. Yeah, we have an app where you can read all the the stories that we have. We have a ton of stories. We've done um like a book with uh Steve Epting and Jonathan Hickman called The Academy. Um uh Jerome Opinia has done some books. There's like a whole bunch of artists that have like that have uh I've been like missing out. Well, because it's it's online and like I realize it's kind of cool when people say I've been missing out because it's like, well, now like you can just jump into this world, like it's been three years of it. But it's cool that we've been able to um survive off like three years of making this stuff without even people under uh like most people knowing it. We just have the community, sure, right? And that's kind of helped us, you know, get to the next year, to the next year. And the coolest part of it is now everyone's gonna get to see like what we've been working on, and and you know, like the true test of if people are gonna like it. But yeah, it's it's it's been amazing. And uh yeah, we I went off track about um what this this uh Three Worlds, Three Moons is about, but basically it's like uh the fight between magic and science. So in different worlds, let's say the book that I'm working on is Shift, it had it's basically the end of the magic cycle, right? And it's showing how like basically things start to shift into science. And like it's basically about a boy that's uh that grows up and he has to wake up the uh the AI god, you know what I mean? The god machine. Yeah, and um that would once that guy's once the the god machine has woken up, it's the shift to towards science. So all these stories that we've we've played with, like foundations, shift, academy, they all kind of play into those different cycles. Foundations is in the science cycle, and it's like whenever one is dominant, the other one almost becomes it's almost like blasphemy, right? So um it just kind of like it just goes into these cycles, which allows us to kind of work with both genres. And I think that was like the main idea is to kind of mix these genres together and be able to work on two things fantasy and you know, sci-fi.

Badr Milligan 43:43

Yeah, I will say the your character designs in this, it feels like I mean, correct me if I'm wrong, if it almost feels like you were given like free reign to just go all out for the care. Some of these, uh at least in the first chapter of Shift. Man, I mean, it it feels like you are diving. Into you're you're digging into this fantasy bag that I don't think I've seen and like that I've seen in some of your other work. I think the Marvel stuff is you know, obviously you're dealing with like existing characters. We've seen these characters, you know, for years in so many different ways, but not like that much different. But then I look at what you've done in Shift and it's like, holy shit, he's digging into something else. I mean, is is that how you feel?

Mike Del Mundo 44:22

Yeah, yeah. It's a it's a this book's actually exactly what I was trying to do with like Weird Worlds, like all the past books that I've done. Yeah, um, weird, even Thor, like just like the way I apply I apply the colors and this and that. One of my favorite movies, uh actually, like I guess top five movies is Secret of Nym. Yeah, that's good. Like, Secret of Nim is always kind of like the reference to to everything I do in terms of color, in terms of mood, in terms of like just the feeling of it all. And um, the only thing missed, like I was trying to do that with like Weird World and like all these, all those past books. The only thing that was missing was like these anamorphic characters, yeah. So shift is you know what kind of drove that. And like I was able to really do my my version of like my favorite movie. So that's that's uh that's shift in a hash show.

Badr Milligan 45:21

Can I also say that um you are also it feels like diving into like kind of like your Kirby bag in the sense of uh in the first chapter of Shift, there's a lot. I mean, like you said, you know, you were dealing with uh science and magic, but on the science side, some of the machines that you're drawing in the background, the technology feels very kind of Kirby-esque where it's like larger than life, complex looking. Like can you talk a little bit about like where you're drawing inspiration from in terms of like references or or things like that?

Mike Del Mundo 45:51

I guess it's like a mix of Kirby and even like like 90s comics, because that's what I grew up with. And I can never get away from it, you know, like just like the tech that they the exaggerated tech back in the 90s, you know. So it's like a mix of that and trying to kind of stray away from that and like add like more realistic tech, more Kirby tech, more simplified tech, stuff like that. So I think all those together um encompasses what I was doing with Shift.

Badr Milligan 46:18

Yeah. I think trying to um it sounds like trying to dilute what three worlds, three moons is into like a one sentence or one podcast episode is definitely not enough. Because there's a phrase that I keep seeing online when when you should describe it, where it's it's uh, I think it was actually on this pop first article, they they had a part, it said, no, not just a single comic or a single series. We're talking about an entire universe to tell stories. And you know, we're finally getting like the physical debut of these comics, you know, start in July and so forth. So to go back to what you were saying about how it's been impressive for y'all to be like, you know, we're three years in, we've got all these stories. I had no idea someone like Steve Epting and and uh uh Jerome Pena were doing stuff, you know, like it feels like you guys have been like Jerome's actually the first, one of the first artists to do like stories, yeah. Okay, I yeah, I have got a lot to catch up with. And I think that's what makes it exciting that I know that this existed over here, but I've been so preoccupied over here that it feels like, man, I I can't wait to get into that club. And you guys are opening the doors, like, hey, here's what we've been, you know. Speaking about Hickman, I think that's been his whole premise with like the whole ultimate universe is that you know, like someone like the maker has been asleep for a year, and in one year he's gonna come back out and he's got like all these, you know, you're like, what has he been up to? It feels like I'm seeing the real world version of that. So I will say, if uh it's you could have told me, matter of fact, I could have went into this conversation not knowing that Hickman did this book, and the way you described it, I would have just said, so Hickman's writing it, you know, like in terms of like the world building. Um, I did flip through uh a foundation just a little bit, and once I saw the infographics, I'm like, oh, this is going to be this is going to be a blockbuster event.

Mike Del Mundo 48:02

It's it's a lot to it's there's a lot. There's a lot, and uh there's a lot that we've built, and it's just the beginning. It's literally like everything that we've done for three years is stories that uh talk about the universe. It's not even the main story, it's just getting you familiar with like the religion of like how transportation works, how the world works, like how everything it's like you're getting an encyclopedia of basically our world-building encyclopedia of Three Worlds, Three Moons, so that once you get into the main story, you're just familiar with like everything that's happening in this world, like you're immersed. So that's what we were trying to do for the first three years. And then now we're moving towards the main storyline.

Badr Milligan 48:47

Man, this is, I mean, just hearing you talk about it. This sounds like the the type of book, the type of series that for people that love like getting into the nooks and crannies and you know, guides, and and it sounds like almost like a comic book meets like you know, a Dungeons and Dragons campaign, you know, like how they'll explain it.

Mike Del Mundo 49:07

It really is, it really is. It's very detailed, even for me, like I'm still learning about the world, you know. Like I think that's I we're on the journey with you, Mike. Yeah, when me and uh Huddleston are working on like you know, concepts and ideas and storylines and covers, I'm going into those books and like rereading certain things because there's so much involved in it that I don't even know everything uh involved in like these worlds.

Badr Milligan 49:36

A couple weeks ago I was talking to Joshua Williamson about uh how far in advance he plans, and he's like, you know, if you could see my whiteboard right now, it's like you know, filled with stuff. I imagine that on steroids times a hundred for someone like Hickman. And especially maybe for this, has he ever shown you guys like like uh like does he have a Bible? He looks like the type to have like a Bible, you know, a book about the book itself or a giant whiteboard. I can only imagine what his notes look like. It's all in his head, man. Get out of here.

Mike Del Mundo 50:06

I'm sure the Bible is he's like Jay-Z, man. Like the Bible, the Bible's in his head.

Badr Milligan 50:13

I was trying to sip water. That's funny. That's great. All right, I can't wait to.

Mike Del Mundo 50:16

I don't know. I like I don't I don't know if I've ever seen him with like a like a Bible, like a like a notebook, but he just sits down and he just talks, talks ideas. So like it's all in there.

Badr Milligan 50:27

That's dope. Yeah, yeah. You are you've got a so by the way, you've got a solid team behind. I mean Hickman, uh Huddleston, um uh you mentioned uh Epting, Opinia. Who else are you working with? Anyone else?

Mike Del Mundo 50:38

Well, the four guys, um, the four main guys is uh Jonathan Hickman, Mike Huddlson, Nick Spencer, that's right, Nick Spencer. Yeah, and Nick is actually um kind of like the mastermind of like how everything's working in behind the scenes. So he's like making things happen with stories with with Jonathan, and he's always he's also making things happen with everything else, like the app, like you know, all the background stuff. So yeah.

Badr Milligan 51:06

Impressive, man.

Mike Del Mundo 51:07

He's the mover, yeah.

Badr Milligan 51:08

I can't wait. I look, this won't be the last uh question or time we talk about uh shift or foundation or through worlds, three moon in general. But uh Mike, I want to get into uh our next segment. It's one of my favorite segments of the show. It's called the short box friends and family segment. Uh, it's where I shut up for a little bit and uh let someone else ask the question, all right? L I let other friends and family chime into the conversation. And um, I gotta say, when I put out the word uh to the short box nation that I was gonna have you on the show, you know, submit some voicemails, some submit some questions from Mike. I think I I've never gotten this many responses. So I've tried to whittle it down to four really good ones. And I've got two voicemails and then two questions, all right? We're gonna start off with a voicemail from Ben Kingsbury, all right? He's the owner of Gotham City Limit Comic Shop. And uh when he heard you'd be on the show, he had a good question line up. So let's hear from Ben.

Ben Kingsbury 51:58

Hey Mike, Ben Kay from Gotham City Limit. Thanks so much for uh taking some time to jump on this podcast, answer a question real quick. First off, congratulations on the new art book. It's gotta be uh surreal moment and an awesome achievement to have uh accumulation of all of your artwork in one single hardcover, that's gonna be great. That's kind of where my question stems from. You've been doing artwork for Marvel for a very long time. Now you're jumping into some DC covers with Flash, Lobo, DCKO. How has that transition uh worked with your style? And have you had any uh interesting stories tied to having to look up new information about some new characters you've never worked on before? I'll leave you here to answer. Seriously, thank you so much for everything you do. We couldn't do it without you. And remember, Store Fox Nation, who always take it to the limit. Peace.

Badr Milligan 52:53

Hey, big shout outs to Ben. This is your first time doing DC covers, right?

Mike Del Mundo 52:57

Yep, this is my first time. This is like I started off with a flash and um yeah, I've only done about like 20 covers.

Badr Milligan 53:05

Damn, that's still a lot.

Mike Del Mundo 53:06

Um, so it's it's it's it's it's new and it's like I think it's like the the right time to be working on it too, because DC's pretty exciting right now. Hell yeah. And um and working with the others have been has been amazing. So, what's it like working at DC? It's been it's been good. It's been a good transition. They're pretty hands-off.

Badr Milligan 53:25

Has it been a a one-for-one transition in terms of like how you normally approach covers and finding the concept and then actually doing the work? Like, have you had to change your style or approach any dealing with a different set of characters?

Mike Del Mundo 53:39

No, I it's been pretty much the same. I I mean, I always thought that because I've all I've always been a Marvel guy, you know. I mean, like I grew up reading Marvel. I mean, aside from a couple Batman books, um, but most of my books were like X-Men and Spider-Man. Um and DC was kind of like it was there, but like I was I was never like a DC guy, but like working on the books surprisingly is like been really fun. I think it's just a uh I guess like a it's a nice change of drawing new characters. And uh, you know, I've worked for I've been drawing for Marvel for 15 years, so it's just a nice, you know, breath of fresh air, I guess, working on like new characters and you know working on the absolute characters is pretty hella fun too.

Badr Milligan 54:29

Yeah, yeah. That yeah, I they're giving you like free RAM. I'm scrolling, you made a post uh uh two days ago, um, and you made it like a compilation of all the DC covers you've done so far. And I I mean tell me if I'm wrong here, but I feel like you're having a lot of fun doing the flash covers. There's one in particular, I don't know what issue number this is, but it's the pinball cover. It's like flash and a pinball machine, and you got all these DC references. Like, who's been your your your favorite character to like play around with and work on?

Mike Del Mundo 54:56

Right now I'm working on Clayface. That's pretty fun. It kind of reminds me of like uh like the X-Men legacy themes that I'm working with, just because he's just like this hunk of clay. Yeah, he's malleable. And you can kind of interweave them into like different things, and so there's a lot of stuff to room to play with. Uh the flash was the flash was fun, but like he's the flash, so it's like that took a that took some like brain power just to figure out what I'm gonna do with it, like the ideas I was gonna put into it. Um, so I would say clayface, yes.

Badr Milligan 55:32

And I think it's a good time for Clayface considering you know the trailer just came out, you know, James Gunn has been hyping it up, the movie will be here later this year. I I think those covers, man, I think it's it's yeah, it's a good time.

Mike Del Mundo 55:43

I did I did a cool I did a cool Superman cover that that hasn't come out yet. I'll be on the lookout. I think that's gonna be fucking cool.

Badr Milligan 55:48

I can't wait. I'll be on the lookout. Okay, uh big shout outs to Ben. That was our first voicemail. I got another voicemail for you. Um, and I'll reveal who this is uh at the end. I'm gonna see if you if you can recognize his voice. Uh, you guys have worked together before, but uh I'll leave it a surprise. All right, here we go.

Zach Norris 56:04

Yo, yo, what's up, everybody? My man Bodder, Short Box Nation. How are y'all doing? Deadly Mike, what's up, bro? So, my question is, Mike, you've spent a lot of your career working in an industry where you've played with other people's creations, you've had to operate in other universes and mess with other characters that were created by creators from the past and kind of handed down story after story, book after book. But with three worlds, three moons, that creative shoe is on the other foot, so to speak. You and Jonathan Hickman and Mike Huddleston are creating your own world, creating your own characters, and then bringing in outside creators to fill out those worlds and expand those universes. What's it like operating like that? What's it like being on the other side of that coin where you are letting go a little bit of that creative control and letting people build out the universe of three worlds, three moons. Hope everybody takes care. I'll see y'all when I see y'all.

Badr Milligan 57:09

Peace. Mike, I'll go ahead and just ruin the surprise. That was Zach Norris. All right. He works at Now or Never Comics. That's true, Zach. Yeah.

Mike Del Mundo 57:16

Oh.

Badr Milligan 57:17

I realized I realized I realized I just realized he never said his name in the voicemail. I should have told him, hey, at least mention your name so you get credit. But that was Zach Norris. Uh he works at Now or Never Comics in San Diego. He's also the creator of an incredibly dope hip hop and comic book zine called Cream Uh Comics Rule Everything Around Me. Uh, he also, uh, you two both had an interview uh for uh the website Sketched, I think last year. It was uh one of the longest interviews I had ever read uh from you. It was really insightful. So that was Zach um asking you about Zach. Yeah, big shout out to Zach. So he's asking about what it's like uh be getting to work on three worlds, three moons, make your own characters, work on your own character, you know, your your own world, your own legacy. What do you think?

Mike Del Mundo 58:00

I think it's really cool. Like um I've that's the first time I've ever like designed original characters. I did a few like like like for Weird World and like here and there, but like creating a world and like designing them and seeing them being drawn by like other artists was really cool. Like it I'd rather see that than me doing it myself.

Badr Milligan 58:22

I didn't think about that. So so you're saying like you've you've designed is the same thing you've designed all the characters for Three World, Three Moon? Yeah, uh me and Mike Cuddleston. Okay, we we go half and half. And then you're saying someone like Steve Epting and Jerome Opinia are doing their interpretations and working off of your designs in books. Yeah. Oh wow, that's crazy.

Mike Del Mundo 58:43

So it's it's really cool. It's just the process is just really cool. Like, it's like we'll do our our our initial designs and then they'll interpret it different, and then like it's kind of cool because that character will evolve into what they've drawn, and then the and then other artists will draw what they've drawn, their interpretations, and it just like it's kind of like broken telephone, where like this character ends up like you know, looking totally different, but it's just cool just seeing the evolution of it, you know. Yeah, like we have a character that that is um a stag, and they call him the white stag. This is our main character, actually. He's like our R2D2 of like our universe, his name Sig. And because he's the white stag, when I designed him, I made I designed him as a like a white stag. It's in the name. Um and I guess like communication-wise, we don't we just kind of we're in our we're in our our um our studios and we just draw in. So I got the white, I got SIG as the white stag when he's younger, but eventually like when you see this story, the older version of Sig is brown, and I think it's just like kind of like this people are just interpreting it different. And like, I guess in terms of like coloring it and this and that. So it's just cool to see the evolution of this character go from like how I started it to how it is now. And like I don't think anyone has any problems with it. We're just kind of just like, yeah, okay, cool, go for it, you know.

Badr Milligan 1:00:13

Yeah, man. I I I love hearing this collaborative nature of what y'all got going on. You know, like it's it's hard to define. It feels more like an experience, like you gotta experience three worlds, three moons. It feels like what you guys are tapping into is like is like ahead of its time. I think in a couple years, we'll look back and be like, I think it'll either influence a lot of, I think it has the potential to influence a lot of new creators to try something like this where you guys are like building out, I don't know, just redefining what it means to have like a creator-owned comic and a you know a creator-owned universe. I I think there's something really special going on here from an outsider looking in, you know. I'm just saying it from like someone that hasn't even dived in all the way. So it's cool to hear that um, you know, all you guys are like, yeah, we're just making great comics and it's so you know, like there's no ego, it sounds like.

Mike Del Mundo 1:01:00

I believe when Jonathan first brought up the idea of Three Worlds, Three Moons, he wanted to he wanted to be like a real collaboration, like a mixtape, basically. He said it in a different way, but um it's it's basically like us just freestyling. Okay, we're in a cipher and we're freestyling. That's what I would explain it to. And it would just be like you go at it, I'll go at it, you do what you gotta do with it, then I'll take it, I'll do something, bring it back to you. And that's how we've been doing it, like just going back and forth. And there hasn't really been like uh, yeah, I don't know about that. I don't know. I was kind of thinking of this character looking like this, or I was kind of thinking of this story. It's almost like, oh, that's cool. Okay, I'll write to that. Yeah, you know, like a jam band. Almost, uh almost like a freeform jazz band. That's that's more like what he was talking about. Yeah, yeah.

Badr Milligan 1:01:53

All right, big shoutouts to Zach. Awesome question. Um, these next two uh I've got uh uh they were sent in via email, via uh uh text. So this first, this other question comes from a member of the short box Patreon community. Big shout-outs to Jerome Cabanitan. Uh he writes As a fellow Filipino Canadian artist, uh, I've got some things I'd love to hear uh Mike speak on. Uh primarily, were there any small turning points, decisions, or connections they gave you unexpected opportunities in your career that you didn't see prior? Also, shout out to you for always being open, approachable, and supportive whenever I catch you walking artist alley. Jerome Cabanatan.

Mike Del Mundo 1:02:35

Um the one thing I could think about is like I discussed before is X-Men Legacy, right? Um I will I I actually declined the job, the X-Men Legacy job, and I remember Daniel Ketchum being like, no, you need to do this. You need to do this. Because I think I remember uh before that before that before the X-Men Legacy gig, I did this Punisher cover. Actually, this is shout out Scotty again, because I think this is really what kind of helped propel me to getting more gigs over at Marvel and getting you know eyes on me. Um Scotty did this Punisher the Untold Stories of Punisher uh Punisher Max, I would say. I'm looking at it. Uh it was a one-shot by Scotty Young, and Scotty wanted me to do the cover, and Dan Daniel was involved in that. Or was it Daniel? I'm not sure. But, anyways, it was like a cover of uh a kid with like two super soakers, and then he's casting the shadow of of the Punisher. Yeah, and for some reason, that after I put that cover out, I had like three or four editors just hitting me up for covers. Wow. And from there, the X-Men Legacy gig came, and then I wasn't gonna take it, but then Daniel was like, No, you gotta take this, and I'm like, Okay, cool, I'll do it, whatever. So I guess that I guess that example is like an example. I think that's a prime example. You know, if I didn't, if that didn't work out for me, maybe you know, my path would have been totally different.

Badr Milligan 1:04:09

I guess like had you declined, have you really been like, hey, I really just can't do this Ekman Legacy? I'm getting married, it's a lot right now. What do you think would have been the next? Like, would there have been another gig? Was there another? Uh you mentioned like uh multiple editors hit you up after this uh Punisher Max cover, which by the way, for anyone curious, it's Untold Tales of the Punisher number five, uh, written by Scotty Young. Uh and you're right, it is Daniel Ketchum, uh, was the editor on this. What other editors hit you up? Was there another like maybe title that you would have hopped on instead of X-Men Legacy?

Mike Del Mundo 1:04:38

I think that was like my first like run of covers. I might be wrong, but I believe that's my first run of covers. So um what when I was getting hit up, it was just for like you know, covers here and there. Got it, got it. One cover here and one there.

Badr Milligan 1:04:51

So X-Men Legacy was like, hey, this is a stable, you know, multi, you know, a multi-issue gig going on right here.

Mike Del Mundo 1:04:59

Yeah.

Badr Milligan 1:05:00

Cool. Okay.

Mike Del Mundo 1:05:01

And it like the difference with that book is like I didn't know what to expect with it. Like, I didn't even know that I would be making those kinds of covers for that book.

Badr Milligan 1:05:11

Yeah.

Mike Del Mundo 1:05:11

So it was like a cool like evolution. Like I was like, oh shit. This is what I do all the time. I could do this. They're like, yeah, do it with this book, you know?

Badr Milligan 1:05:19

Yeah, it's like the perfect book to do it, considering like the character, the premise, like, you know, just how uh just how kind of meta that uh that that's that series ended up being. That's cool. All right, so that was Jerome Cabana. Tan, big shout out to Jerome, by the way. He is uh, like you said, he's a Filipino Canadian cartoonist. Uh he makes some really awesome kung fu martial arts action comics. One's called Tree vs. Fox, and then he's got an all ages one called The ABCs of Haya, which I think is is awesome. Okay, I I know Jerome now. Yeah, yeah. So he's good. All right, and then last but not least, I got one more question from the short box nation. This one comes from Jeff Fremed. Uh, I mean, right before I hit record, he hit me up. He was like, I got one more question for I got a question for Mike. Please let me submit it. So big shout out to Jeff. Uh, he wrote in and said, uh, okay, it's a scenario question. It's the 1980s going into the 90s. What are your top five hip hop groups and why? And his definition of a group is two or more people. Now, I I want to alter his question because knowing what we talked about earlier about uh Sanford Green and then you know the age disparity and then also um the age difference and then where you started hip hop. Let me alter his question. It's the 1990s going into the 2000s. What are your top five hip hop groups or just acts in general?

Mike Del Mundo 1:06:39

Top five hip hop groups. Uh MobD, obviously Tri Quad Quest. Yeah, Slum Village. Dang. Top five hip hop groups.

Badr Milligan 1:06:52

There's one you haven't named yet.

Mike Del Mundo 1:06:54

This is like duos or like two or more. Two or more. Oh, two or more. Okay. Yeah, Wu Tang. Um, oh,s a mischief, man.

Badr Milligan 1:07:05

Okay, there we go. Yeah. And I'm sure there's more that I missed. All right. There's one that I was waiting for you to say. Um, Farside. I know that you are a huge Farside fan. Farside, yes. Which by the way, uh, I'm gonna recommend. I'm gonna go off script here and recommend to you a mix. I'll send you this mixtape via email. There is a um, there is a mixtape by who did this mixtape? Uh is this Jay Period? Ah, I'm I don't want to flub it up, but there is a blend tape called Bizarre Tribe, a quest to the far side, where they um I'm pretty sure it's Jay Period, but I I don't want to misquote, where they take a tribe called Quest, samples and beats, reinterpolate them, and then they put um uh far side lyrics to it. And when I tell you it is one of the most solid blend tapes I've ever heard, uh, you know what I'm saying? It's like combining two of the best groups of all time, tribe and far side. I'll send it to you. I think you'll I think you'll check it out. Yeah. Yeah, send it out. And I guess real quick, I guess on the topic of hip hop, if you don't mind, uh, one of the things I've been dying to ask you, because when we talked last year in August, you had hinted at something big coming along, but I think it was too early. And then, you know, uh October hits, New York Comic-Con comes around, Mass Appeal drops big news that they're teaming up with Marvel. They're putting out this comic called Legend Has It. They're, you know, reimagining, you know, rap icons like Nas, Slick Rick, and Mob Deep as superheroes. Sanford Green is doing the cover. Um, it goes crazy in New York Comic-Con. I was there. Nas shows up in New York Comic Con. They have a giant panel. Rob Markman is hosting it, you know, Raquan is there. Uh De La Sol is there. Sanford Green is on the panel. And it's like, wow, this is the pinnacle of hip hop and comics. And then shortly after that, I think like a month or two later, they announce guess what? We're doing variants for this issue. And we're we got a Mike Del Mundo variant of Nas and DJ Premier. That the light year, was it Light Years Ahead? Is that the name of the album? Um, yeah. So what was that? I mean, what was that experience like getting the call from Mass Appeal? Which basically, uh, you know, everyone's been calling it Nas's company. I think, you know, at this point, you know, obviously there's a lot more players involved, but Nas is so such the the spearhead for what was that experience like getting the call from Mass Appeal to to work on a variant cover for like this pretty monumental comic at the time?

Mike Del Mundo 1:09:23

Yeah, it was it was it was incredible. It's like I grew up with literally like my my my entry into hip-hop was like from 1993 and up. So I grew up with you know Ilmatic, basically. Like Ilmatic is like my top, it's gotta be like my my top two favorite albums. Yeah, I would just say top one. Yeah, my favorite album, basically.

Badr Milligan 1:09:45

Yeah, like it's top two and it's not two.

Mike Del Mundo 1:09:49

It's in between, it's it's between Ilmatic and um the infamous. So um, but yeah, man, that's like that's a dream. Like every time those things happen, it's like it's a dream. And then then there's Nas, and then my favorite one of my favorite producers, man, DJ Premier.

Badr Milligan 1:10:06

Did you get a chance to like talk to Nas to DJ Premier about like any conceptual stuff or or what the cover would look like or your interpretation of their superhero characters?

Mike Del Mundo 1:10:16

Um no, just um actually like shout out Sanford Green. He's the one that hooked up, you know, hooked up a lot of artists to get on those uh those variant covers. So a lot of my dialogue was with Sanford because he's the one that designed all the characters, he did all the character designs. So I took what he, you know, some of his notes, but a lot of it is just trying to, you know, just taking that energy from from like me growing up in that era and understanding the character, like understanding Nas and Primo in that and making sure I get their likeness properly, you know. Yeah, I think you know that. Yeah, so that it was pretty much just just me and Sanford, yeah.

Badr Milligan 1:10:57

Yeah, that's dope. Um, I know that so they put out the the variants, and then I guess the variants did so well, they were like, hey, we're also going to re-release all these albums that we've been put out as part of the Legend Has It with a variant cover for the vinyl. So uh I missed out on buying the Legend Has It comic variant, but I I did end up scooping up one of uh the vinyl for Lightyear's album with your artwork, and I can't wait to have that.

Mike Del Mundo 1:11:21

I can't wait to I actually bought those two. I bought I bought I bought the vinyl, man. I'm like, yo, this is a variant version for this for like an album, like I'm on an album, like a NASA album.

Badr Milligan 1:11:32

Oh my god, that's like I want you to keep that top of mind. Uh, because I I've got I've got something to show you when we wrap up. But with that being said, that is all the questions uh uh I've got for the Shortbox Friends and Family segment. Big shout out to everyone that submitted a question. Big shout outs to Ben, big shout outs to Zach, big shout outs to Jerome and Jeff. Last question to wrap us up. Where do you go from here, man? You know, I mentioned that this has been this is an interesting time to be a Mike Del Mundo fan. And I can only imagine just how interesting it is for you, the actual person. I mean, you're doing covers for DC, your first, you know, DC gigs. I mean, all the covers have been looking amazing. You're working on a Superman one now. You got the Three Worlds, Three Moon stuff coming out in physical, you know, making its physical debut uh next month. Um, the art book is finally coming out. I mean, it feels like we're getting to, I feel like, really see you like flex your creative muscles. I love the fact that there's a spotlight on you and all the great work that you're you've been doing. But like I guess what's next for you personally? Like, do you have like an uh an accomplishment in mind next, like a bigger goal? Because it feels like, you know, like where do you go from here as a comic book artist? It feels like you've accomplished so much and you've done so much. Uh, what's next for you?

Mike Del Mundo 1:12:43

Yeah, it's it's it's been great, man. Like, especially last year, being able to finally do like a Marvel art of book, you know, that feels really special. And then working with, you know, working on like my favorite like hip hop artists. Like it just feels like like divine intervention, man. Like it's just like it's just like all my bucket lists are kind of out of the way.

Badr Milligan 1:13:07

Um, damn sure it feels like it. Yeah.

Mike Del Mundo 1:13:09

Uh so the only thing left is for me is like I I do want to just start creating my own IPs, like creating my own stories, and I think that's the next move. I got a lot of ideas, yeah.

Badr Milligan 1:13:20

Like in a way that it's like like I you know, I'm hearing you say like through those three moons, like you're designing all the characters and all that. You're saying like completely something like separate.

Mike Del Mundo 1:13:28

Yeah, yeah. So like obviously, like that's it, like that that in its own is still is we're still working on like big stories for that. So we're moving on that, and you know, I just I just have a lot of ideas, like a lot of story ideas, a lot of characters, a lot of stuff that's going in my head. And um, you know, I wouldn't be happy if I didn't visit those, you know, before I turn 50. You know, that's like my goal. It's like by the time I get to the five-zero, there's a bunch of stuff I want to do and yeah, at least make something for myself, you know, like just me.

Badr Milligan 1:14:03

If I can be so selfish, I think the one field genre medium that it would be dope to see more Mike Delmundo artwork or representation is video games. I think your style would go really well in an animated sense or like a uh like some sort of like short form indie video game. I I don't know why, but I think it's like the colors, the the visual narrative, the concept, all the things that we've been talking about. Have you thought about you know, maybe diving into a completely different medium at all?

Mike Del Mundo 1:14:32

That would be cool. I mean, like doing concepts for like video games has always always been a dream, like just doing conceptual art or even movies.

Badr Milligan 1:14:39

Yeah.

Mike Del Mundo 1:14:40

Um, but yeah, like you know, one of my dreams is to just have my own book. That's that's as simple as it gets. You know, like I love the medium of comics and I just love the having it in your hands, smelling it, yeah, you know, smelling the pages. And uh I don't know, that's it just makes me happy, you know.

Badr Milligan 1:14:58

No, I look, I uh reading through the art book with the sketchbook, I'm someone that will always champion uh like digital comics. I I think they're convenient. I think as someone that has a room that is slowly closing in on them, like sometimes digital is the answer for things, but in this case, I can't wait to have the art book in my hand with the sketchbook. You know, that is something that I want to have a tactile feel and to like compare the two. You can't quite do that with digital, it's a little more cumbersome, it's not the smooth process, and it's not the same.

Mike Del Mundo 1:15:28

The reason why that book um we created like the thumbnail book is we were kind of like battling with the idea of like putting them in into the the actual Marvel Art of book, but there just wasn't enough space. And I was kind of I was just being greedy. I was like, I want all my covers in there, you know. So I'm like, let's just why don't we do a separate book and just add everything? So you got the book, you got like the the the big one, and then you have the companion for all the tiny sketches. But I feel like it's like a cool book to have for um, you know, people that do what I do, like ideas.

Badr Milligan 1:16:03

Yeah, and actually, I uh actually I want to end on this question. Considering that it is such uh an you know, it it literally is an art book, and then I think I think artists themselves, aspiring artists, uh established artists, etc., can can take a lot from that book. What do you hope that like a young aspiring artist gets out of that book? Like should they go into the shop, they have an opportunity to order it, order the book, they're going through it. Like, what do you hope resonates with them the most?

Mike Del Mundo 1:16:31

I think it's just like, especially for that book, is a book of ideas, you know, and I feel like it helps you see what's possible, you know. Um, there is a skill in terms of like coming up with ideas, like just a way to rework things. There's there's different skills involved in it. So hopefully that book like you know, is almost like a how-to in terms of like how to come up with concepts, stuff like that, help you on that road, you know.

Badr Milligan 1:17:01

Yeah, no, that's dope. And I think with that being said, I think this is a great place to end this conversation. Mike, you have been fantastic. I don't think I've ever had someone on for a third time, but I'm hoping that uh I'm hoping that you'll be the first.

Mike Del Mundo 1:17:12

I hope so too.

Badr Milligan 1:17:13

I hope I I'll be back whenever you need me. Hell yeah. Done deal. Thanks for having me, man. Ladies and gents, this is the short box podcast. And we just finished talking to Mike Del Mundo again. All right. This is a consider like, look, this is part two of uh of already a long part one episode from last year, but we just finished talking about uh his new art book that'll be coming out uh later this summer. Be on the lookout for it, all right? It's called The Marvel Art of Mike Del Mundo. We've talked about Three World Three Moon. That's also coming out later this summer. Be on the lookout for foundation, be look on the lookout for 3 World Three Moon's shift later in September. Uh we talked about coming from Dark Horse. Um, and we've talked about, I mean, process, we've talked about family, we've talked a lot. I mean, hip hop, obviously. We talked about a lot. So, with that being said, I'm gonna have links to uh Mike Del Mundo's uh social media, his Instagram, which is worthwhile to give a follow. I love anytime you post like the DC cover recap and all of that. I'll have a link to uh Mike's uh website, Substack, all that good stuff. It'll be in the episode description and show notes. Give Mike a follow. Be on the lookout for all these future projects and announcements. And uh yeah, keep on listening to Shortbox. Welcome to season 11, baby. Hey yo, run it back. How's this? Ooh, better? I do like that better. It's a little more basic. I like that. The other one sounded a little more tinny. Okay, sounds good.

Mike Del Mundo 1:18:42

Yeah, I'm not I'm not a techie guy, so bear with me.

Badr Milligan 1:18:46

None of you artist types are. No, man.

Mike Del Mundo 1:18:50

I was like Riverside? I know uh you know what's crazy is like when we figure it out, we're like pros. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. But like it takes a while to figure it out. Yeah, I got you.

Badr Milligan 1:19:02

Nah, you got it.

Mike Del Mundo 1:19:03

Like, even Photoshop was like Photoshop was a bit of a task, you know.

Badr Milligan 1:19:07

What's your main program? Is it Photoshop or Illustrator or something different?

Mike Del Mundo 1:19:11

Photoshop.

Badr Milligan 1:19:12

Really? All Photoshop. Yep.

Mike Del Mundo 1:19:15

Damn, that's incredible. Uh Clip Studio. If I'm working on um interior art, I'm using Clip Studio to do all the layouts and the line art and stuff. But I kind of interweave between both. But like for covers, it's Photoshop.

Badr Milligan 1:19:30

Cool. Okay, yeah. I I uh work with a lot of designers in my day job and they prefer Illustrator, which makes me think that like, you know, I've always been told Illustrator is more for like creating things. Photoshop is like mainly photo manipulation, but some of the stuff I see people crank out in Photoshop, I mean, case in point you, is truly remarkable if you got a good understanding. I guess like, do you have you ever tried Illustrator? Do you have any thoughts on like Illustrator?

Mike Del Mundo 1:19:55

Yeah, actually, speaking of like being bad at technology, um, I learned I think like my first software was Illustrator. Like I learned that in design school, and I wouldn't even say I learned it. Like everyone was kind of excelling. They were just like killing it with all like because they they know the software, and I was like, yo, if I just knew this software, I would just I would be able to design this nice prototype of a car like exact. But that took me a while. Actually, my boy helped what actually helps me a lot is um when I actually start working on a job and applying myself to those to those uh applications, then I actually learn it and figure it out. Right. But it takes a while. So like I learned that first, and then um well, actually, I lied. I mean, I fiddled with Photoshop in grade nine when it first came out. But uh Illustrator was like my main software I use just before I got into comics. I was using that to design like Chuck E. Cheese games and all that stuff, right? That's what that's the platform we use.

Badr Milligan 1:21:05

Do you feel like you're a pro at Photoshop, or are you still learning? Like, do you ever look up like uh tutorials on YouTube on Photoshop? Like, or do you feel like I pretty much know all the tools I need?

Mike Del Mundo 1:21:15

Yeah, I guess I feel like a pro. I mean, I'm I it's it's it's funny because Photoshop is like it was made for photography, right? It's like to manipulate photography, but like there's just we ended up finding a way to like color with it, you know. Like I think it was Wills. I I think when I was talking to Wills Pertasho, he was talking about how when Photoshop first came in, they were the they were the testers. I don't and I might be talking out my ass, but I from what I remember, he was telling me that like yeah, it was meant for huh, you know, photography manipulation or cleaning up photos and stuff like that. And then we just the comic industry just figured out, oh, right, like we could use this to color on. So as you can see, uh all that all the early stuff, right?

Badr Milligan 1:22:02

Is like huh? Do you know how hip hop that is? That you know, like uh to take like a piece of technology and to like completely change its like, you know, like to make it your own. I think that's kind of like a cool like hip-hop element to it.

Mike Del Mundo 1:22:15

That's how like the best things happen, right? It's like um, but yeah, I mean I mean, I could call myself a pro, but like everyone has their own path on Photoshop. We've all kind of sat there, played with it, figured out the things that we like about it, our brushes, our textures, this and that. Yeah, and we find we've found different paths into like uh different ways into doing the same thing almost. Yeah. You know, so that's hope. Everyone, what one guy could be doing a totally different way of coloring versus ID.

Badr Milligan 1:22:50

Let me ask you this. Um, who do you think who would you say is like when you think about your peers and other people that work in the comic industry, who do you think is like a monster at Photoshop? Like, like if you had a question, you're like, I know I can ask this person and they're gonna have the answer. Shit. I don't know.

Mike Del Mundo 1:23:10

I've never asked anyone. Um is it safe to say you know a lot of people that are using Photoshop? I'm trying to think because there's a lot of people I know that are like traditional, like straight traditional. So um I'm my mind is going blank right now, just trying to figure out who would be like a dope person to ask. Okay. Because usually I just go on Google and you know, like Yeah, yeah, yeah. How do you I'm stuck on a button here? Like, how come like how do I just fidget back to like my my normal settings, stuff like that? What? Um, but um if it comes to mind, yeah, if you if it comes to mind, if I wanted to uh to remind me, that'd be kind of cool to hear. That's a good question, though. Like, I hadn't never really thought about like traditional artists versus digital artists, and how like but man, if if you know that, if I know that guy, man, I'd be calling him every day just like you know, like